What characters are good for beginners?

Try Wolf. Very different from shun etc and has his own challenges. I have been playing him since VF2 and he is the only character who I have played consistently all that time. I also play (and like) Aoi and Goh and I am having a go at re-learning Vanessa (very different in evo).

 

I found a new character. I suck with her right now, but her moves are so freakin' cool it's not funny! (Whereas Shun's moves are so freakin' cool AND funny...)
Anyway, I went throught command training for each other character, and I picked Aoi. I liked her 'cause her moves are so graceful and they look so painful. I'd hate to fight her in reality -- I don't think I'd survive the experience. I named her Owie-Aoi in Quest mode. /versus/images/graemlins/crazy.gif Anyway, one of my favorite things about Shun is his punch counter (after 10 drinks) that's so fun to whip out and peg my friends with in the middle of a fight when they're least expecting it. Aoi has those for EVERYTHING! It's like Christmas, my birthday, and Halloween all rolled into one!
Anyway, sorry for carrying on, but through some advice on this forum, and mostly by not choosing the popular characers ( I am a Shun player ), I found a new character to build up and play around with. Thanks guys! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

-Chuck

 

Jesus Christ dude! Shun?! That is NOT a good noob choice. He is way to hard, with all his stances and all that 1/4 circles. NOT a noob player! No way, José!
Maybe, if you want a challange, u pick him as your first char..

 

Also, that they are good for beginners don't mean they will suck later. Against AI as players, Sarah, Jacky and other stay good choises.

Is called "expert" characters who are good at defending (like Akira), "beginners" characters who are better attackers (like Jacky, Sarah...)

Gorbag

 

Aoi is an excellent choice! she is my other character. (I know I said to try wolf, but Aoi is good too)

 

Hey guys,
Shun's difficulty to learn is what makes him such a good character for beginners. I don't know about you, but I love a challenge. Isn't that the point of playing a video game at all? /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif That and to have fun?
I guess it isn't for some people. They just want to win as easily as possible. But that's why I was turned off by characters like Kage and Jacky and Lau. It's too easy to win right off the bat. Then when your opponents get difficult, you don't have any practice with the more complex stuff that you need to win or even have a decent fight.
I'm attracted to Shun and Aoi because of their huge library of moves. It lends them enough variety to make any fight interesting. It also gives them more ways to keep your opponent guessing.
Also, I much prefer fighting human opponents than the computer. My best friend plays a wicked Jacky. His style is so fluid, and his rhythm is so hard to break. I'm a friggin' Sentinel with Shun in Quest mode (which is great since I don't play it much, and it only took me like five weeks) and he still gets excellents on me. 'Course, I do that to him too, but still!
Anyway, I'm rambling again, but I think I've said what I meant to say. I mean, if you want to master a character, go with Sarah, Lion, Kage, Lau, Pai, Vanessa, Wolf or Lei Fei. If you want a character with simple moves and complex strategies, go with Brad, Jeff, Goh, Jacky or Aoi. But if you want a challenge and a character with depth and -- in Shun's case, humor -- pick Shun or Akira. They are very difficult to master, but it's SO worth it, man! (And don't take any offense by this generalization -- it's just my opinion.)

Thanks,
-Chuck

 

Hey,
Thanks for the encouragement! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif Y'see, I'm actually having trouble with Aoi now. She seems a little flat. I guess maybe I just haven't mastered a lot of her basic counter-hit moves and their follow-ups, but I'm finding her much harder to learn than Shun was. Or maybe I just don't remember how hard it was to learn Shun . . .
Anyway, I haven't had a chance to test her out against a human opponent yet ( I try not to rate my skills based on how well I can fight a computer ), so I don't really know how well I'm doing.
Thanks again. I'll have to try Wolf again too /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif !

-Chuck

 

Aoi is a mind game character - guard cancels, fast punches, crumple attacks, reverses, sabaki, YY stance, throws of all types. It's hard to play mind games against an AI - you can't really condition it and confuse it. She really shines against a human foe, though. Try to get used to using guard cancels even when fighting the AI - it doesn't seem to do much except get you hit, but it's a necessity for fighting humans.

 

C'mon dude.. Shun is so complex, he is NOT a beginner char!
I have problems playing him, and i have 4 champs.. (with getting two of them there in less then 2 weeks /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif )
Btw, everything u say, is so bullshit.. sad but true /versus/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

No offence mate but maybe you haven't played the game enough to really understand what characters would be good for beginners etc when you're happy you got your shun up to sentinel in the 5weeks play you have with him.

I think you would have to have played that much, atleast (read this as more) with all the characters you're trying to rate or atleast have a very strong grasp of the game mechanics etc (play more of this wunderbar game ^__^ !) . It just feels abit like you're in love with every character you play (and get positive feelings about them) and hence want to recommend them to everyone. /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif

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If you want a character with simple moves and complex strategies, go with Brad,

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Thanks man /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

/KiwE

 

Definitely Lau and Jacky. Lau's is super easy to pick up and Jacky is designed for newbies (not that advanced players can't use him of course).

 

[ QUOTE ]
HungOver said:

Thanks for the encouragement! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif Y'see, I'm actually having trouble with Aoi now. She seems a little flat. I guess maybe I just haven't mastered a lot of her basic counter-hit moves and their follow-ups, but I'm finding her much harder to learn than Shun was. Or maybe I just don't remember how hard it was to learn Shun . . .

-Chuck

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I think they are very different characters because I had a lot of trouble with shun when I tried him. I have found the good thing with Aoi is that she can open and close distance very quickly with moves like and . You can get away with doing most of her moves without getting thrown too. Because of this you can get away with being a bit reckless, because you know you can rely on things like or+. whatever you do, don't turtle! it is much easier to use her defensive moves when you tempt them into a particular attack. for example is like asking the other player to elbow you and most players will. The trouble from their point of view is that you know that is what they are going to do and are ready with the reversal.

 

First: I don't think Aoi is to good for beginners since she lacks serious damage.

Second:
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Definitely Lau and Jacky. Lau's is super easy to pick up and Jacky is designed for newbies (not that advanced players can't use him of course).

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I agree here. Players that are easy to set up Nitaku (two option situations) with are usually good for beginners (in my opinion). You'll get into the game pretty quickly with a way of thinking that is usefull with all characters. I don't know if this is true but I always felt Jacky and Lau is good because of this. Keep the sabakis, reversals and higher techniques out in the beginning. They really just mess things up /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

Wow,
I see I've sparked a bit of controversy. I guess that's good, I mean these are for discussion, right?
First, to Mysterio's comment:
I already explained that Shun's complexity is what makes him interesting, and the fact that he's hard to grasp makes him feel like you've accomplished something. I'm sorry if what I say sounds like bullshit. It's not. I do tend to write a lot, though, so my points may get lost.
I was introduced to the series about seven or eight years ago with Fighters Megamix (and I rented VF2 before that, but that was just for a few days.) My best friend and I would play that game almost every day against each other on my Sega Saturn, and eventually stopped playing the Fighting Vipers characters and just stuck to the VF side of the character select. Later, he bought a PS2, and we both chipped in to buy VF4 the day it came out. We played all the time at his house, and I got good with Kage and Jeff, but since I didn't own a system, I got less practice. When he bought Evolution, we were both really excited. We were friggin' addicted to the game, and that's when I picked up Shun again.
In simpler terms, I know what I'm talking about. I mean, I didn't create the game myself, but I've got an idea of how it works. Also, I approach each new version of this game as a new game entirely. That's what they are, really. So the fact that I picked up the Evo Shun so quickly is saying something.
Second, to Kiwe's comments:
You've got pretty good insight, but you're a little off. I just explained my experience with the game. Also, I only got a PS2 in January. I don't play much, what with the rest of my life taking up so much of my time. ( I wonder how some people manage to live, they're so obsessed with games . . .) /versus/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
You're right about my love for characters, but since I was speaking to glorify them in the eyes of a newbie, I made it sound like I wanted to have Shun's children. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif I don't, really. I know he has some major disadvantages, especially the fact that some of his stances put him in forced-choice tactics situations. Since I don't play much, it'll take me a while to really try out every character in the game, but I've gotten used to that idea. I just take 'em one at a time.
Oh, and I'm glad you liked my Brad comment! Again, hope I didn't offend anyone. /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
Third, to Shoalin_Hopper and Robio_kun:
Thanks, I'll keep those things in mind while I learn how to play Aoi. And I don't feel so bad about my win ratio. I still haven't played my friend with her. /versus/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Forth, to Nybec:
I don't recommend Aoi to beginners. Her library would seem small to a beginner. Her moves are so hard to manipulate in combat. It's difficult to learn when to use what. Shun doesn't have that. He's pretty straightforward. Of course, he seems just the opposite to your opponent, but that just makes it more fun! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif
And, everyone has Nitaku, Aoi having the most and easiest entries, from what I've seen.

Well, there's my half hour of typing for today. /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif [whew!]

Play hard and have fun guys.

-Chuck

 

Nice input - yeah I thought you were new to the game and my bad but that's how I read your posts. /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif

But I simply have a problem agreeing to the fact that you seem to think that character complexity is good for a beginner. Or wait, I have no problem with agreeing to that you think so but that you think that others should / will think so aswell (since you recommend him to everybody).

If character complexity / "hard to grasp" is good (and positive factors) for a beginner - is a character that's not complex and easy to grasp bad? Think about it man cause it makes no sense to me /versus/images/graemlins/blush.gif /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Over and Out.

/KiwE

 

I would not reccomend shun! He has no elbow! It would be really hard to grasp the basics of a game if you're missing a lot of the basic tools that shun is missing (elbow, straightforward combo starters, moves that leave him ADVANTAGE on hit like PK should), so you'll miss out on that type of play.

Someone like Jacky is well rounded, has a little bit of everything, and would be good for beginners. He has a damn good elbow, safe mid combo starter, unsafe mid combo starter, a quasi-stance, circular crap, some defensive tools (scratching an itch beats high/mid punches), etc

Nothing is really spectacular, or neccesarily a great tool (except elbow), but he has a lot of the stuff that shun is lacking. If shun want's to put the opponent in a forced choice, it is much more difficult - shun's big advantage is that he can get out of those situations very well (many of his moves 'beat' a large pool of moves)

So with Jacky, it would be easier to switch to another character because you've picked up the basics of playing with advantage/disadvantage, but if you learn on shun, you will still have to learn that, instead of playing the 'this beats that' game.

 

Well, yeah . . .
Character complexity is good for the fact that it teaches you variety and discourages pattern development. I know that if I can pick out an opponent's patterns, I can easily beat them. You have to learn how to adapt, and that's more interesting with a larger library of moves. Also, with Shun, you have to use variety, or the computer will kick your ass.
I really should have mentioned Jacky. He was my favorite in Megamix, and he is an excellent entry into this game. It was an oversight. /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif My bad. I personally haven't built him up yet. He's my friend's character, and he and I kind of have our own characters, and we tend not to play each other's. I should get over it, I know . . . /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
Shun does have moves that put him in the advantage, such as . Mostly, though, he ends up in a disadvantage or he knocks someone down, which automatically puts your opponent in a forced-choice situation. Anyway, he taught me tons, but every character is great, if you learn to use variety and learn how the game works. There's my argument for Shun though (all over this thread. /versus/images/graemlins/crazy.gif )
And anyway, I remember something someone said in this forum about picking the character you like the most aesthetcially. It's true. I guess really the reason I love Shun so much is that my favorite Kung-Fu flick is Drunken Master. And Shun does a lot of the stuff that Jacky Chan did in that film. I find him really entertaining, and since I normally hate to play video games -- especially one-player video games -- he keeps me coming back for more. But then again, so does everything about this game. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Peace.

-Chuck

 

THERE IS NO NOOB CHARACTER IN VF!!

Theres no tiers, so why should there be noob characters.

ITS ALL ABOUT FINDING A CHARACTER YOU LIKE AND STICKING WITH IT!!
simple as that . . .

for people who say akira is hard blah blah, thats for choosing to play him hard. You can always get away with more simple damage combos untill your reflexes improves. Its the same with any character, you start out with basic stuff, and move onto more difficulty.

the key to getting better is to enjoy yourself,
if you're unhappy with playing a character, just because someone said it was a noob char- whats the point of playing.

 

Rant mode on. Swe lost hockey = damn.

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You have to learn how to adapt,

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Which is easier if you understand your moves (and it's easier to understand them most often if they are fewer) and if they fit logically into the engines system (such as Syikos point about elbows). Making a nitaku situation, logically (as with a normal elbow) and it being easily visible, will of cource teach you easier about nitaku / forced tactics then some move that you don't even understand what kind of advantage / diss you have if it connects. Understanding the engine is as important as understanding your own character and that's also more easily done with someone that fits perfectly in under it. A Lei player who doesn't understand his advantage on block will prob even gaurd after performing the move in most cases making a bizarre situation. Besides; learning Shun will as a side effect also learn you how to defend against Shun aswell but learning a character that fits well under the system will teach you to defend yourself effectivly against a variety.

[ QUOTE ]
Character complexity is good for the fact that it teaches you variety and discourages pattern development. I know that if I can pick out an opponent's patterns, I can easily beat them.

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If you can pick out an opponents patterns in VF it's more of him being patternbased then what character he uses. People are still learning new flowcharts and new aspects to their game after playing for years. You learn variety, as you self said, it doesn't come auto from picking a certain character. In a game of hard counters, like VF is, it's better to really understand your counters and when to use them then having LOTS of them. This will just confuse you as a newcomer to the game. If having lots of moves confused your opponent and keeps you from being predictable (while he was), moves wouldn't be outcrystalized from characters due to their nature as they were learned. The tiers (if there are any) would also prob look very differently if the variety of moves you had / used was an influence as of how good your character was in defence / offence.

Knowledge of your tools > a variety of them.
As a newcomer it's easier to understand few moves then many = a char with many moves might not be the best option. Specially if they are hard to use and/or doesn't really fit well into the system and you having to read a faq to understand how to implement them well.

I also doubt that you can't develop patterns with Shun as with all other chars if you don't buttonmash (which won't get you anywhere at all in VF). It's not like it's easy to even buttonmash shun into a stance to freakin drink after a round man and drinking is a huge part of his game. It's great that you play him and have fun playing him cause playing the game alot is a great way of improving. I was lucky and found a char who fit me aswell, I might not have liked the game as much if I tried to force my way onto someone I didn't (like Jacky) cause people told me he was scrubfriendly. But he is still a great introduction to the game anyways from a theory pr0n perspective /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Forgive the rant and me being abit sleepy when writing this but I'm hellamad for Sweden loosing against Canada in Hockey in such a fucktard manner =(

/KiwE (Blame Canada!)

 

Re: Rant mode on. Swe lost hockey = damn.

As I keep playing VF4, I've got to realize the two types of characters in the game.

One is standard characters, and the other is non standard ones.

The second group contains Shun, Lion, Leifei, and Van. Aoi could be in this group,too. Characteristics of those characters is that they have lots of moves with special properties to compensate for their unstandard characteristics. (e.i. Vanessa has the slowest punch in the game, Lion has a one frame slower low P, Lei's P gives him -4 on block etc.)

I'd like to recommend all those who are willing to give a VF shot to pick a character that are not in the group above. It's not the matter of tiers or anything, but there's a possiblity that when you learn the game with a so called weird characters, you might tend to rely on various properties rather than try to learn the essence of the game, which is how the game flows based on frame adv / disadv.

Moves with properties such as those sabaki moves, Shun's 2K etc will help you get away with situations but could keep you from learning proper defensive tech like throw escapes.

I believe that the best/proper way of learning VF is to learn how the system works ,and then all those different moves and situations with properties.

Of course, this is for the sake of learning the game faster. Whoever you find fun to play would be the best character for you to play as.

Hope it helped.