Exactly. I don't know why some people are going on and on about shallow things like hit effects while not saying a thing about the direction of gameplay. If they need to add more flash and flair to the game to get more notice great but don't water down the gameplay the way they have done with this latest VF. I don't like what they did with VF5FS's gameplay and want them to move on.

When it comes to Tekken and many other fighters is that they have a wide variety of visual designs to appeal to many different people. As long as it has character designs that I like in the game then that's what matter to me. Don't care if it has wild and weird characters as well. Tekken has always had the martial arts themed characters and characters that look like warriors that I like.

@Adam Gibson Sry mate, I'm a VF racist and that regard. I only want VF to be as large as possible but no larger. If it means Tekkenizing VF just to grow the community, then we're not really talking about VF anymore are we.

At the time that Yu Suzuki did the first Virtua Fighter, there wasn't any Playstation or Xbox and the P.C did not have the graphics power to match an Arcade Machine. Recall that Yu teamed up with Lockheed Martin that resulted in VF being inducted in the the Smithsonian

https://www.interactive.org/special_awards/details.asp?idSpecialAwards=4

So when Yu Suzuki produced the very first full martial arts simulation, there was no where else for it to run accept in Arcades. There was no where else he could sell it but in Arcades. That's the only reason why it is a 3D Arcade fighting game now. His compromise was allowing a little floating here and there. But make no mistake about it, Yu wanted to make a fun realistic martial arts sports simulation. And that's what Virtua Fighter is. That's why its so different from Tekken, & Soul Calibur and the 2D fighters. It was a combat simulation from the very start. Of course player these days, I'm not going to name @Dragonps , @Adam Gibson or some of the other apologists for fantasy arcade fighting don't really know the history and real goals of Yu Suzuki Virtua series so we can't blame them (ignorance is bliss). But Seiji Aoki does know that history and he worked with Yu Suzuki and he knows what the original design philosophy was. He violated that tradition and design philosophy by adding Hit Sparks. And now Seiji Aoki 顔の喪失. Kao no sōshitsu.

Aoki did not give VF fans an option to turn the hit effects off! Other versions of Virtua Fighter had an option to turn Hit Effects off. Versions of DOA had options to turn Hit Effects off. Versions of Tekken had options to turn Hit effects off. Versions of Soul Calibur had options to turn Hit effects off. But with VF5US we're forced to look at them no matter how much they ruin the visual aesthetic for some of us. No matter how much they break Yu Suzuki's original dream of a realistic (but fun) martial arts simulation

@Adam Gibson I'm definitely a 3D simulation racist and realism purist (when it comes to VF) . I feel VF is better than Tekken because of the color of Tekken's Hit Sparks and because Tekken is based on outrageous, floaty, flying fantasy based martial arts. And folks that don't appreciate VF for what it really is, and the vision that Yu originally had for the game, they can step off AFAIC


@Shoju Fair enough... I deeply, truly, sincerely hope you're right and that VF is not going to be a Tekken clone. That would be a travesty But currently we have Red, Yellow Blue, White, Purple hits sparks for the first time in the History of Virtua Fighter. We are going to be hosting Tekken Skins for the first time in Virtua Fighter history. Will those skins also include Rodger, Kuma, Panda , and Alisa?
For the first time in Virtua Fighter history it looks like we're gonna have the option for a Tekken UI.
You can understand just a wee bit why I might be concerned about VF's upcoming status as a
Tekken Clone right?

Probably because the team at AM2 has changed over the years and so has the leadership. Different people will want to do things in different ways, also AM2 has been pretty active the last 29 years. Maybe you haven't seen the games they've been working on?

When arcades were thriving and a huge source of income, they've not been either of these things for a long time now.

You know I'm seeing a pattern here, you're so preoccupied with what they shouldn't be doing, but you've not offered one suggestion to the contrary.

Instead of just criticizing why not offer what YOU think they should do.

"I'm not naming names but..."

How absolutely childish, don't think for one second I'm some kid born the 2000's. I'm very well aware of what Suzuki goal was with VF, I even had to correct you on it because you were wrong. Don't drag my name into your replies because you were way off the mark with your martial arts movie knowledge.

You make it sound like he defecated on someone's grave, for goodness sake grow up Po you're acting like a child.

Also mods sorry for double post

I was a little bit excited with soul reverse but the game failed.
But Aoki said there plan was to bring back people into arcade with Kantai collection (I think it's Cancole Arcade extention ) and Gran Fate Order.

Games that look like Mobile game...
I think AM2 has more Talent and deserve more budget in their games.
Epecially when SEGA said recently they have new ambitions.
Especially when Aaron webber said "This is not the same SEGA you knew the last 10 years." (and that now "they'll focus more on QUALITY" )
Especially when CEO Haruki SATOMI admitted "we've betrayed fan's trust"

I'm maybe naive, but still waiting for all these improvements we normally should have then..
Because I LOVE SEGA. And I love VF.

Don't be aggressive please. We can talk like grown up persons and exange opinions.
Maybe you never red my suggestions before so again:

_Bring back effects ahead of their times (No outdated PS1 effects)
_Wet clothes
_Steam while breathing in cold stages
_translucid walls. (Done )
_Weather changes melting Snow effects , Fog effects (VF5 R )
_Day/night or just alternative stages (like VF5 5 R stages
_No more yellow puffballs on normal hit
_Just suttle flashes from VF 4 VF 5 and Saliva drops on counter hit.
_Sweat effects. Particles effects on counter hit impacts.
_Icons for side counter hit.
(Icons already existed like Stagger icon /First hit icon /Score indicator etc..) there are a lot of different solutions.
_Keep the super cool dust effect (it's like an old school kung fu movie )
_If there is an option to turn off the hit sparks: KEEP THE DUST EFFECT ( and VF5 fs suttle flashes )
_Get rid of ALL these outdated cartoonish effects from games like street fighter and make VF a groundbreaking game again like VF always was.

It hurts to see that ALL what Daichi KATAGIRI Makoto OSAKI and Even Yu SUZUKI should be whipped or canceled (my English is bad sorry ) just because of a need to change ?
Change EVERYTHING ?
Only because of ONE man's decision who was NEVER involved in VF..?!
As if ALL what SEGA AM2 did with VF all these years is crap ?
This is super unfair.

"Changes"just for changing is stupid.

At least improve what we should to improve , but KEEP what was GODLIKE..!

On moment please. What exactly is a "VF Racist"? Correct me if I'm wrong, but you also play Tekken, right? I play Tekken, too. So, VF has to reach people who haven't any other fighting game in their life? Sorry, but I don't understand all the Tekken hate.

So, the only difference between VF and Tekken are the hit sparks? And I thought that gameplay, mattered. Guess I was wrong...

You want VF to to turn something else, something like Sifu, UFC, GTAV or whatever video game you have in mind. But, Aoki is the one that doesn't respect the tradition of the VF series, by adding hit sparks. Ok...

I wasn't being aggressive?

c'mon @Shinobi I know you get this. And of course you're yanking my chain. But you got me I'll bite and repeat it again.

First the title of this very thread where your comment appears is suggesting an upcoming
cross between Virtua Fighter and Tekken 7

Virtua Fighter x Tekken 7

Second I thought I expressed my concerns clearly

So, would it be totally outrageous for a VF player to fear that VF5US and a possible VF6 might be Tekkenized considering the following statement:

For the first time in the history of the Virtua Fighter Series:

• Virtua Fighter has Red, Yellow, Blue Purple Tekken Style Hit Sparks

• Virtua Fighter will have Tekken Skins, Heihachi, Jin, possibly Kuma, Rodger, and Panda

• Virtua Fighter will have the option to have a Tekken Style UI

Of course the game play mechanics of VF have not changed just because the look feel has changed. But@Shinobi clearly you comprehend that VF is combination of several aspects. And the game engine is only one of them. If it no longer looks like VF then imo its not VF. Case in fact, at one point DOA was using the actual Virtua Fighter engine. But the fact that DOA was using the Virtua Fighter engine did not mean that DOA was Virtua Fighter. That's because the Virtua Fighter series is a combination of its:

• Riveting, breath taking , clean, realistic, no nonsense graphics presentation,

• Roster of unique fighting styles and unique characters

• Most Balanced Fighting Engine in the 3D arcade fighting scene

• Rock, Paper, Scissors, approach with deep and nuanced offensive and defensive options

All of these aspects make up VF. You take away anyone of them, and its no longer VF. You might not believe that at the moment, but give it a little thought and let it sink in, you'll come around.

And as the title of this thread suggests

Virtua Fighter x Tekken 7

We are about to tread in some very suspect waters. Waters in which the Virtua Fighter series, reputation, loyalty, respect might be damaged beyond repair. And I for one, am just a wee bit worried

On the other hand

Virtua Figher x UFC

Would be a move in the right direction for the Virtua Fighter series

Well, I've always been civil even when I disagree but seeing as how we're now getting into name-calling, I suppose it's time for me to leave this stupid thread. Thanks masterpo for making vfdc a worse place to be. Also that UFC game looks like ripe ass.

@Adam Gibson

Se la Vie

@masterpo you don't like a certain artistic choice made by Aoki and his team, and you accuse him for a thousands of others he did not make. Yu Suzuki made a game where Akira fought the Hornet Car from Daytona USA, and just because RGG and AM2 add hit sparks to Ultimate Showdown, you afraid that they will turn VF into something else?

Look Po, you made your point but you are not helping but posting again and again and again the same thing (Evil Aoki, Sifu, UFC and other games that don't have anything in common with VF etc.). For the love of God, please stop all this negativity. In every thread I read the same thing. Please stop act like it's the end of the world.

Don't leave, there's plenty of mature debate to have.

This is a good point when we take into account how other fighting games have changed and evolved. The look of the SF games for instance has changed so much over the years with different art styles and yet the core mechanics remained the same (for the most part)

Look at other fighting games that have added guest characters or crossover content, it didn't take away their artistic identity.

I heard Aoki say something about a prequel game, this could be really interesting as a way to expose new players to the system of VF. What I love about VF gameplay is that it can be enjoyed on many different levels.

If you're a casual then you enjoy it at the lowest level but there's so many layers to it. I like Tekken but for me it only has like three layers of gameplay from casual to intermediate then pro.

EDIT: Watching that UFC video was painful, so incredibly slow and sluggish even some of the animations were a bit weird. The thing that did it for me though was just how boring it is to watch, like I'd have more fun watching paint dry on a hot summer day with only cold bovril to drink.

For context Bovril is a UK product kinda like Marmite except they did it in a drink form. Unlike Marmite it's made from cows and has a meaty taste kinda like gravy to some.

How much influence does MainManSwe have in the Tekken and FGC

Also I'm still not sure you can judge a game's popularity or success by how many Twitch streamers or Youtube streamers are streaming a game at any given moment..

I guess I'm just too old skool. I think if the publisher made a profit, and the game sold well, and the fans give the game a good rating and they want more, that to me counts as successful and popular

What does the game being streamed on Twitch or Youtube have to do with whether the fans are happy with the game or not

Absolutely nothing remotely unique or interesting about him, BS clickbait scam artist. Has about as much influence as taking a whizz in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean and hoping someone saw it.

Thing is that profit has to be big enough to pay all your staff, managers, artists, testers etc. Then the investors have to be happy, they need to see their investment was worth it. The amount of profit needs to be so huge that even if you make a little it's normally not enough.

Tekken fans making fun of VF visuals (from the former best studio in the world: AM2 )
KUMA Panda PAUL JACK fans making fun of VF characters ? Seriously ?
and EVEN VF's animations ?! WTF

That's why VF has to be the best looking game again..! With groundbreaking visuals and effects (not PS1 hit effects)
Charismatic faces , like VF5 gorgeous CGI models..!
Maybe they'll remember that VF was always an amazing technical showcase.
Maybe they'll remember VF was ahead of its time EACH iteration! And stechnically super impressive!
That's why I don't want SEGA to save money with a low end Virtua Fighter sequel Reboot, only E sport oriented (with the bare bone minimum like Aoki's Puyo Puyo Esports) or a free to play ,just Because Puyo Puyo and phantasy star Oline 2 were big success .
VF deserves better than just look like a free to play,a mobile game or even a Bamco outdated Game

If SEGA AM2 R&D 2 (Research and development department 2 ) , are not doing research and development like before: by working on VF as a technical showcase for their future games (and arcade cardboards ) it's like SEGA is not doing research and development anymore !
AM2 was the best studios in the world for years.
I want them to come back and hit hard with VF6.

This is the proof that mimicking Tekken effects or visual is maybe not the route to go, and that VF should stick to its identity and martial arts philosophy.
A game that would look like Tekken 7 (Even in in 2016/2017) or unreal engine Soulcalibur 6 would still be disapointing

VF has to be the standard meter of innovation. Reaffirm its identity rather to ape Tekken's or street fighter's

Certainly from my perspective MainManSwe has no credibility and his stream had more than a few inaccuracies. My query to this forum was trying to gauge how much influence does MainManSwe have in the Tekken community in particular and the FGC in general. I know some members on VFDC are very well connected in the Tekken community and other FGC.

As far as what it means for a game to be successful or popular. Tekken producer Harada made an interesting statement about Mortal Kombat's success compared to Tekken and Street fighter.

Curiously enough Harada did not cite Mortal Kombat's rollback netcode, or the vibrancy of its online competitive community as its reason for selling more copies than Tekken and Street Fighter.

Exactly my friend, he did not mention it. That's my point. In other words he was attributing MK's ability to sell more copies to something other than the size or success of the online community

In many of my interactions with my fellow mates on VFDC I try to make the point that significant single player content is the foundation for a sustainable online community. I acknowledge the importance of the competitive online community. Whereas I try to conceptualize the success of a fighting game as the result of both single player for noobs and casuals and competitive offline and online play., many of my mates on VFDC seem to think that the raison d'etre of VF and any other FG is simply its competitive mode whether offline or online.

Harada's statement gives my VFDC diatribes at least a modicum of credence