Virtua Fighter 6

I absolutely despise the Oki game in Tekken. It is ridiculous. Against certain characters in certain parts of stages, hitting the ground is all but instant death. I agree that on a logical basis, if I do a move that scrubs the ground, I should be able to hit a downed opponent. But, in the current VF system where damn near everything can put you down, that'd be way too powerful for characters like Lion...

Tekken is good at being Tekken, VF is good at being VF. Let's keep it that way...

 

VF shouldn't be copying Tekken just because Tekken has it. Tekken-style Oki isn't really fun until high-level, and is a turnoff below that.

This is why the Tekken designers have a nasty problem on their hands for T7- they gotta make it new because the series is stale and that's hurting US sales, but any changes are going to be met with super-fierce resistance by the vets. It's not an enviable situation.

 

Exactly thats what makes the okizeme or recovery system broken. Ive seen people get juggled from recovery because its so broken. If you do a wake up attack and it whiffs then you deseve to eat a combo. But when you get frame trapped on the wall, because your getting spammed by kazuya low sweep combo everytime you try to get up.......well....lets just say it makes it a very annoying and scrub friendly expierence.

 

Proper tech rolling in Tekken has the same invicibilty as it does in VF, and true tech catches hasn't existed in the series after 5 excluding Bryan's taunt setups, which are severely gimped in TTT2, plus not counting situations where you can jump behind your opponent or such. The differance is that rolling is separate in Tekken in the sense that it's not a true tech like in VF as you can be hit during side rolls and even picked up into a juggle from front and back rolls. As some stated previously, you can hit a character lying on the ground with a number of moves including most lows and even mids as long as they continue to stay there and not tech properly, but there is a damage reduction in this; hitting someone on the ground while they're neutral only does 100% damage of the normal 135%, and is further reduced from rolls IIRC, and they can tech out after being hit safely. Another differance is that okizeme in Tekken is purely advantageous to the attacker as getup kicks can be beat at any moment during their execution and they are almost always at least -12 on block (which is much more serious than it is in VF, Tekken jabs are 10f and 12f is a step above in punishment) and some are launch punishable. So the reason why it might seem like if you get knocked down, you die is that the differance between a good player who knows the oki system and one who doesn't is significant as the oki system is not as forgiving as it might be in VF. Saying that it's bullshit in either game is ignorance and I recommend practice mode for that.

 

no need to get mad i want him to be brutal just not to much i never said to go back to vanilla or evo he was boring back then i like him now just make a balance between crazy and traditional

 

Overfiend is like that about everything; I'm not sure he's even getting all that mad.

 

Actually I think the Tekken Oki is weighted very heavily in favour of the more experienced player. If you know the system it's quite rare to be brutalised by this although you will take a few hits on the ground. But a beginner who just keeps trying to stand up will be destroyed in short order. You can literally wipe the floor with them.

 

Which is stupid period. My point is y am i getting punished for recovering? Doesnt matter if you still take a few hits or get brutalized during oki. Its still idiotic. Theres no need for it period. They already have had no weight class system in Tekken since 1 allowing you to do alot of dmg all the time. Add that with long bound combos and the game becomes combo heavy making it easier to do combos. Add since there's no evade system + you can block by pressing back, players just BDC to look for whiff punishment to do more mundane combos. Tekken flopped after 5DR. I'll never get back into it until i see serious changes.

 

Still bad enough you getting punish for it and its not like its a few hits here and there.. we talking wall carry overs and big damage combos. Zekiel is right. There is no weight class systems and the combos don't require strict timing. I played tekken since it first game and it rarely changed. the knockdown system is the same still only difference is when 6 came it got worst. T5DR best Tekken game then Tekken 4..
Tekken 4 is more gear towards the mindgames VF than anything thats why it was considered not the best.

 

Well in a real fight your opponent is not going to stand back and let you recover. But the viscous Oki is very much a Tekken hallmark so there is no need to bring it into VF.

I agree about Tekken going downhill. Tekken 5DR was the pinnacle and I had been a hardcore Tekken fanboy since Tekken 2. But when Tekken 6 dropped I retired from Tekken. Now I have VF:FS I don't even miss it anyway. Let's hope Virtua Fighter 6 is just as awesome.

 

Yeah it's heavy, man. That is no lie. If you don't know what you are doing you can just get the sh*t kicked out of you on the ground, maybe taken up into a juggle while trying to stand etc etc. Now they have added bound BS to it so it is probably even worse.

Tekken 4 had the best movement in any 3D fighting game (apart from Soul Calibur maybe). There was proper free movement in the 3D plane.

 

Actually Its even WORSE in TTT2 compared to T6 because of tag combos making the already long mundane combos longer. Now its all about who has stronger combos. And the lol part is your cant fight with your remaining character. Once one character is knocked out you lose the round. I cant think of any other fighter that doesnt allow you to play with you remaining character.

 

Let me address a few points here.

Tekken comboes don't require any timing? Try Kazuya CH df+2, EWGF. Or something more simple like Paul qcf+3+4, dash P, f+1+2. Heck, even most characters' magic 4 comboes require timing to connect a dash jab afterwards in order to juggle.

There is also no weight class system in the VF sense, but juggling characters is actually the opposite of VF; Smaller characters are harder to juggle than larger ones due to hitboxes with exception of the bears as even though they are large, they have short feet.

You also never get directly punished for recovering, on your scrub level it might seem so, but as I said previously Tekken has not had true tech catches since like 5.0, and proper teching has the same invulnerability as it does in VF with the except that you are not vulnerable to absolutely anything after teching, unlike in VF where you can be crouch throwed, and I'll also repeat that rolling is a not a proper tech in Tekken. Many new players fall victim to "infinite juggles" due them always holding back when they're knocked down to initiate a quick back roll, which is vulnerable and can be catched into a juggle resulting in much crying about a juggle fest game. The one who knocks the opponent down controls the wakeup situation absolutely, as I said, just as it should be with no invulnerable wakeup kicks or other dumb shit with the exception of Tag Crash in TTT2, a mechanic added purely for scrubs. Tekken is also very movement and spacing oriented, it's absolutely important to learn how to BDC to play efficently, and while there is no 'on-rails' evade system like in VF, side steps and side walks evade stuff with the same efficency as in VF as long as you know how and when to do them, kind of like in VF. I personally think the much more fluid movement system is vastly superior to VF's 'stiff' system, plus the game doesn't hard penalize you for trying to move around, unlike VF or SC5, if you got hit during an side stept/backdash, it's just your fault.

I can, however, agree on that Tekken has become more combo oriented since 6 with the introduction of the Bound system, and even more so with TTT2 with it's Tag Assault juggles, and yes, I also think it has degraded the series along with the absolutely retarded crush system and nerfed side steps, and that T5DR is the best Tekken game forever, but all the Tekken fundementals of spacing, pressure and such are still intact in the newer games as well, and Namco has shown shown a little bit of interested in reducing the dumber stuff down by making generic hopkicks a little bit unsafer on block compared to before and with much needed character tweaks like with Lars in general.

Tekken 4 is fun BTW, but ultimetly ruined by Jin. That game also had actually the worst movement in any Tekken game because BDC was killed and side step changed to side walking only, even though it still worked well.

So please, either learn to play the game, or shut up about things you don't know. Thanks.

 

I think the point most people are missing is that, regardless of whether or not you can get off the floor or whatever, it just isn't fun to be the guy spending half the fight and most of his health getting low-kicked over and over again. Doesn't matter if there are ways out of it or whatever - the whole thing just reeks of cheesiness and gameplay that isn't fun.

In VF, you get knocked over, possibly take a pounce of some kind, then you get up on the frame disadvantage and are back to playing the real part of the game.

 

Leave being on the floor as it is and leave everyone not having low throws and counters as they are. They're not necessary for everyone to have.

 

Learn to play? Nigga Please... Before you tell somebody shut up about anything.. Them bullshit combos and EWGF bullshit you mentioned are still weaksauce. Get the Fuck outta here. EWGF difficult? Please..Once you said that i bypassed all that other dumbshit you wrote which was exactly what i said in a few sentences....trying to Co-sign a bullshit 2-D game masquerading as a 3-D fighter. Tekken is the only series i can leave alone for months get back on and continue exactly where i left off. Like i said T5DR is the best Tekken has to offer. 4 stepped away from being a jugglefest you bitches cried and 5 went back to being as simple as 2 & 3.

 

Nigga please, learn to read. I never said EWGF in itself was difficult, in fact it's quite easy after some practice. But go to practice mode, try and do Kazuya CH df+2, EWGF so that he EWGF launches normally, I'll guarantee you you will not succeed even after 1 hour. Go try out the other example comboes too, there's no bullshit about them, they require pretty strict timing.

Oh, and about Tekken 4 not being a jugglefest, the most broken move in the game aka Jin's JFLS is an unblockable launcher with practically 0 risk except against a few characters, namely the one's with a punch reversal/parry. From it, Jin can do something like 45% comboes against everyone, if we won't count the stage infinites, which BTW many characters have. The combo damage in that game was pretty high across the board because of how you could end a combo in a spike move and then hit them while they're on the ground doing 100% damage vs. the normal scaled damage in a juggle.

Please, for your own sake, stop posting unless you want to make yourself look like more of an idiot.

 

Tekken's stepping and side stepping is as good as VF's? hardly. Ive seen online and tournament matches. players hardly step at all. The main defense tech i see is BDC. THATS IT. I hardly see anything else. And most people who sidestep have to predict what the opponent will throw out and do it b4 the opponent starts attacking. Which is stupid. Since when in martial arts do you see people ''evade'' ahead of time? L O L never. Its always a instant reaction. And you cant get punished for backdash because of BDC. In VF BD should be a CH because your dashing and not defending.
They had to do this because VF5 BD was too good. Yomi you say Tekken's space oriented but thats not a good thing. Like i said because guard is <- it allows BDC which slows down the gameplay + no evade system makes it slower. Sidestepping in tekken overall is too slow and not a good defense option like it is in VF. Parry is hardly used either. lve watched skilled players on yt and they hardly use parries. My guess is do to the pointless LK RK

 

LP RP buttons. Parries are probally affected by this also. So in the end the only defense tech used most of the time is BDC. Another thing i dnt see alot is throws.
The reason 4 this is because the throws have certain positions (left throw right throw?). You can see what type of throw they use before they grab you mking throws easy to escape.

Overall Tekken's gameplay is slow and not straightforward. Theres always ''with the exception'' or ''but u have to use ABC for this to work''. lts all about BDC. Thats all i see 90% of the time. Every other defense tech is unrefined. Thats just how it is.

 

Ok... Wow... Just...

I need a drink...