VF5R online play???

Agreed. still, if im jacky vs akira and I block akiras 66p+k,p and I KNOW the opponent is gonna either 2p or eteg and I want to condition him to block, I would use 46k+g with jacky. A few times online my 46k+g lost to 2p right after I blocked 66p+k,p. Sure, I understand what is happening and I can backdash 3k or backdash p+k,k but why should I have to settle for a weaker option and the possibility of creating a bad habit?

 

Situations like that are why I barely bother with online anymore.

 

Well SOME people are assholes.

The fighting game community, long before VFDC, SRK, or IRC, was 'theory fighting' on USENET in the alt.fan discussion groups for quite some time.

Theory fighting, or paper fighting, is an excellent tool heavily used by the 'pros' or expert players. Things like the white books or orange books with frame data and strings, studying replays and frame data after matches, are things that the most dedicated players from around the world do.

In fact it is the best players that usually are the players theory fighting. You aren't going to find scrubs or fresh meat seeking out players to judge nitaku and janken (RSP) situations and to find out why the double palm was changed from -10 to -14 or whatever.

Don't listen to the negativity of people whining about theory fighter. I only picked up Goh for VF4EVO after Creed wrote his amazing guide about it. I read his guide about ten times, then took Goh up in practice mode, then started playing Quest/offline vs to put him in match situations. The guide, and discussions with my peers, only served to augment my understanding and playing ability with Goh. Theory fighter didn't hurt me in the least.

Online matters for many players to get good competition. Top level non-Japanese Street Fighter 2 and MvC/CvS (and all 2D) players have been using GGPO for a while to practice when they can't travel. And even outside of fighting games, RTS and FPS gamers have been playing online for years as well and the cost to the integrity of the competitive balance is just as high when latency is introduced.

When it comes to practicing a fighting game for a serious competition (SBO/EVO/BeatTribe/etc.) there is no substitute for offline play. And there really is no substitute for an arcade, but consoles offline are the next best thing, and past that online is the next next best thing.

Overall I'd say this: the community is more competitive with online than without.

No matter what I'll always hold the VF series as the best fighting games series ever made. But in the interest of online competition being my only competition aside from a yearly trek to EVO and some other tournaments it's painful for me to play an outdated version of VF5 when games like ST:HDR and SFIV are getting ported to consoles with amazing exclusive content.

If VF5R doesn't come to consoles I might forgive Sega. VF6 is the last straw before I can't take anymore pieces of my soul dying to disappointment from Sega/AM2/VF.

 

This situation right here is exactly what everyone dissing online can relate to.

 

I just played Konjou in like 50 games Akira vs. Goh, when he did 66+PK,P and I did knee it landed CH every time without exception if he 2P'd.

But you know what, I'm sure Jeneric, Skatan and LA Akira know more about online play then the people who you know, play on it.

 

I've played online enough to know if the person is not in the same city as me, I cant play like I normally do offline. how close are you to konjou? The closest player I have near me is 70 miles away and that is plague. No one else in LA really plays the game online. Lag is dependent on the distance which means I'm not gonna get the same vs konjou like when you play with konjou.

 

I'm in FL Konjou's in NY, but you know what this is all so pointless. I just want everyone to get along in a happy VF world : P.

 

Me too man.. Ive been a vf evangelist in the days of VF2 and VF3 because I just didnt understand why people would rather play MK over VF. Its a great game and even though I don't take online very seriously, I have fun with it sometimes.

 

Yeah, because I didn't play online at all before making my assessment of it...It's not like I was tied for highest rank with Konjou, Denkai and maybe one or two others.

 

I don't remember ever typing that you haven't played online before.

 

What exactly is the argument here and what is everyone's standpoint?

If the argument is that offline play is useless then anyone who says it is is just being silly.

It is without any question of a doubt the best way to learn the basics of the game against human opponents. You have to keep in mind that, for some people (myself included), offline play against people who know what they are doing is a rarity.

If the argument is that exclusive online play ultimately hinders your progress as a competetive player then the people who say it doesn't are wrong.

I honestly don't think I need to go into much detail about that.

 

If my low punch hit, then my high punch gets punched out of by opponent. That sucks.

I am nearly completely unable to play my normal 'reactionary game' because latency kills the response time. And this is against everyone, even against most of the 3 bars. Im reduced to attacking nonstop so I know what the frame situation is when my moves connect and are blocked instead of pure guesswork. And thereafter I just do pure block/abare attack guessing because it is more effective than trying to input ETEGs or something, because the timing is too hard to pin down even against opponents who wouldnt delay their attacks unconsciously (latency) or consciously.

You think teaching basics is possible in these conditions?

In essence, online is bad for my game, Im only going to get worse personally by playing it. I can only get a slight motivational boost by being able to play at all (occasionally, when there are opponents).

Not everyone feels like I do though.

 

It's all semantics, but you might wanna read that sentence again. I also said that in a response about a situation that happened to LA Akira while playing online.

 

Sorry to derail this thread once more!
LA I have started playing quest mode after getting pretty disappointed with online comepetition.

My favourite quest AI is an Eileen called MAYA. It reminds me a little of KINGO's Eileen, in the way she can abuse her punches and ETEGS all the time.

I am glad I can get some good examples from the AI over and over and over unlike when playing a friend.

Is there any AI you can recomend me to study a particular situations? I know it would only apply to that particular AI only, but I think quest mode might be there for this very purpose.

 

I got tired of quest mode after finding out whenever I got in trouble- Jeff 9K+G was something that would never get punished ever.

 

Arstal, I am not asking for an AI killer tactics, on the contrary, I am asking what AI best suited to study a particular situation.

 

While english is not my native language, I read the sentence as:
"But you know what, I'm sure Jeneric, Skatan and LA Akira know more about online play than the people who play on it."

The "you know" can be ignored if you just made a typo and forgot one ','. Its written like, you know, this way.

 

The CPU doesn't really play like a human, it reads your inputs. I don't find playing the CPU helps me too much other than with execution. The beauty of online is getting to see how humans react to different game situations as opposed to training against the CPU.

If you exclusively play the CPU you might think PPPPPPPP is a good tactic cause it works.

I just feel playing a human is better than a CPU no matter what. I can play Plague from Mass. and I don't think it's that laggy at all. The major point is though, I NEVER WOULD HAVE GOTTEN TO PLAY ANYONE GOOD WITHOUT ONLINE. Being able to play you guys is a huge bonus for my skills, even if a few games lag here and there. Getting tooled on by Luck_GT improved my Goh a lot.

 

You live in boston? There are players in boston. Get off your lazy ass.

Also, in the interest of defending what LA was saying about the CPU, cause I'm sure he's tired of doing it himself . . .

Its not about just abusing 9k+g or whatever. It's about noticing "oh, this guy likes to finish jacky's jab string, what can do about it?" and practicing responses. Each individual AI character has different patterns it likes to follow. The advantage here is that the cpu wont get bored, and you don't have to worry about whether what you're trying to do failed because it really doesn't work, or just because of lag.