VF in Belgium and The Netherlands

nice meeting today:


@pascal: you lost your dge you had in the previous meetings, still don't know what happened. really try to add punishment to your game, your game is still lacking a stable damage income

@spoon: also for you, really work on punishment. pai is easy as pie! -10 = p or pk, -14 is 9k+gk. all unsafe lows are -14 or higher so you don't even have to think about it. evading big attacks and having moves whiffed in fromt of your nose means instant 9k+gk, try to keep this move in your RAM memory so you can access it instantly at all times when needed.

for both of you: without punishment the opponant will never be scared to attack you and will continue to pressure, pressure and pressure some more. if you want some freedom to set up your own attacks, to control the match, to setup your own strategies you need to punish the opponant so he will start thinking about how to approach you. punishing is the easiest part of the game, it's just like DDR or guitar hero: press the button at the right time, no thinking, no stress, it's free damage you are getting!

punishment will I think also bring structure in your games(something i feel lacks in both your games, no consistancy) because you will feel a little more safer. in your head you can think: if jacky does 33k u can pk. so when you block 33p you can stay calm and do pk and while you are doing pk think about what you are going to follow up with. like i said to you spoon, with aoi: you block 33k, you follow up with pk and then you can do 33p~4p+g. you are calm because you know you can punish the timing for the hitthrow is easier to do, it is always at the same distance, so always the exact same timing. you don't need to think, just execute.

@seiko killa: i didn't think you played all that well today, your spacing was very bad, you left a lof of freedom for the others to start their own games. try to keep in range that 4k or another long poke will always interrupt them, that is a scary situation to be in vs wolf because you are scared of the throws at all times, and from that range 9p+k works vs low punch, even if a lp whiffs you can dash in low throw. i think you are closing off too many of your own options to play wolf at 100%.

@krye: i didn't find your pressure game to be that scary today, don't have a reason for it though, still great 2k+g max range usage and your ability to dash in and throw is still too scary, it makes me want to crouch all day.

 

Nice meeting yesterday, as usual, haha.

My 2 cents:

Pascal: Try to rework some of your flows, most of them don't make sense (I'm thinking of just having your 2p blocked and using attacks afterward, hit confirming is key). Only reason they sometimes work is because we're not used to them yet/Lion has fucked up hitbox. I'll use bigger attacks next time to show you what's bad about them. General spacing was nice (talking about your general sense of what to do at what distance), hard to get in and I constantly felt pressured! You're also making great use of Lion's awesome oki game, good stuff .

Chris: Get some standard flows into your game, it really occured to me yesterday that you have no base game to fall back on; there's no cohesion between your moves. What Twan said about getting those standard situations (he was talking about pk) in there was spot on, IMO. It's those situations that you need to put the game back in your favor, since it's situations that you're used to, there's no weird things that can happen there, just good and bad guesses. You really need things like that to be able to force your opponent to do things.

Yrvin: While your game up close is nice, your range game is still really lacking something important: WHIFFPUNISHMENT!!!
It's really easy for me to just stand around and spam some moves at midrange, since you're not punishing me for it anyway. It really makes me feel at easy when I'm away from you, knowing that I'm out of danger.. You need to punish, it's really important to keep the pressure on. Wolf's 66p+k is an amazing long range whiffpunisher and up close you can use moves like 3k to just knock people down if they whiff something. Start practicing it, it's something you should try to master before we go to Sweden, since they won't be forgiving when it comes to spacing. It doesn't seem like a big thing, but it's important to do, even when the moves you punish with don't deal too much damage.

Twan: Even though you were a bit rusty, I thought you played great. You still need to work consistent TE's in your game, but aside from that, your spacing, pressure and most importantly your adjustment to your opponents was really on point yesterday, good shit .

Me: Some things went great, other things were a bit 'meh'. Like Twan said, my pressure was poop, I was spamming random strings for no reason... I also didn't use 46p enough.
I'll play better next time /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

 

The reason I keep on using 2p as much as I do is because I usually seem to create enough distance between Lion and my opponent just because Lion's 2p has more range. It's such a "way of life" for me doing this that I find myself in trouble when playing with other chars, doing my 2p stuff again and suddenly find myself getting punished a lot more!

As I've said often enough tuesday, I don't really understand why I wasn't playing as well as before. It certainly didn't "feel" like I was doing some things worse than other times, but the results say enough. Especially the 18-or-so matches I played against Krye were really...embarrassing; it took way too long before I found myself winning at least a few rounds in succession and I also ate a truckload of excellents. As Twan already said too, I just wasn't dealing damage: just a few seperate hits but I was more busy trying to get used to any patterns I could find and especially getting used to that high-speed Lau you always play.

And the next time I find myself on the right (2player) side, I'll just have to quickly move behind the tv so that I still have the feeling I'm on the left. Maybe that will help...

 

Hold RB while choosing quest mode..

And about the 2p stuff, yeah I know why you keep doing it, it's just that it's gonna be such a big part of your game that when we get used to it, you're gonna eat so much damage...

Twan should just knee you after blocking 2p, since you'll eat it every time if you're gonna keep on doing the things you did before. I'm not saying it's stupid or anything, just that you need to watch it/mix it up/not rely on it as much =).

 

Your meetings seems cool guys /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif
I'd like to take part in one of those sometimes, France isn't that far

 

Let us know when you want to come over and we'll arrange something /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif . The same goes for everyone that would like to come over some time to play some VF with us, btw.

There's a trainservice called 'Thalys' that goes from Paris to Amsterdam and viceversa, it might be worth to check out. You can fly here, but there's a heavy tax on flying to and from Amsterdam Airport, so it might be expensive.
We're having a meeting in Amsterdam on the 7th and 8th of march, most Dutch VF players will be there, so if you've got time, you should try to make it /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif .

 

Zucht... die Amsterdamse jeugd van tegenwoordig met hun MSN-taaltje. Wat is dge?

-Confused Yrvin-

 

edge, lol.

 

ok guys, so 7/8 march. i'll be available from 13:00 and onwards.
if you feel like it you can come on friday too, i'm ok with that, it's just i gotta be somewhere on saturday from 10:00 till 12:30.

as far as i know everyones coming, but i'll just call around to maurits and ake just to be sure(if i don't hear form you guys here), the rest i see on msn or talk on the phone often enough to know you'll be there.

i was wondering if someone could bring his xbox too, i have 3 tvs now (bought this amazing one for 25euro on marktplaats the other day!) and that means we could fit everyone behind a setup to get more games in.

personally, for the weekend,I don't want to play longer sessions that 10 games. I feel that when playing longer sessions I stop thinking and start playing in auto-pilot(see that from a lot of us) so that's going to be a goal for me. not really usefull info, just felt like sharing.

see you then guys!

 

i'll be there!!!! btw what do you guys think of SFIV?

 

I'll be there on the 7th only.

Street Fighter IV is boring IMO..

I'll stick to VF /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

 

nice ake!

i'm going all the way for sf4, really digging it. big attraction for me is the amount of people playing it and less focus on theory.
these seem to go hand in hand as you learn more by playing more different people. because of the small amount of people playing vf I can never get to learn or execute a lot of theory while in sf4 it will be possible to a much further degree.
next to that; rufus is just a supercool character!

 

I know where you're coming from Krye but I wouldn't call it boring. SF4's a lot easier to understand and get a grip on. A very welcome change of pace. It's also helping my input speed no end and forces me to keep a cool head. I hope to transfer some general skills back and forth between the two.

I'm planning to join at least a few tourneys before making a decision.

Already hugely behind in hours played though. Even with an online function... *shakes head

Rufus is bloody horrible. Haven't found my character yet but I'm liking Abel and Guile, completely fail at playing with Viper and plan to put some time into Rose and Cammy.

 

I like it, thought it was a boring game at first but that changed after a week of play or so. There's plenty to be learned and the community is cool.

*edit*

it's funny that nearly everyone who was looking on viper ended up saying whatever.

 

@Vortigar: I don't enjoy playing the game at all, so it's boring for me . It's not even that I suck (even though I do /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif )or anything, it's just that I can't find anything that I enjoy about the gameplay. I don't feel like putting any more time into the game just because of that reason. I'll pick up tekken when it's released, for competition reasons, SF is pretty much done for me. I might give it one or two chances eventually, but not until after Stockholm, at least.

 

i like the game! i already got hooked lol. but i am too noob to play it,lol. anyway if anyone wants to play, invite me! i am using a noob akuma. lolz

 

Krye:
When I said I knew where you're coming from I also meant to say that the game is really straightforward, exceptionally so really. There's no consideration to be made for reversals, staggers, throw escapes, dodges, circulars, delay tactics, etc. I find a high level match in VF5 to be much more interesting and cooler to watch than a high level match in SF4.

But in the same vein it is exactly that narrowness of purpose that I also find enticing about the game. In limiting the options a much less cluttered playfield is created. A purer struggle if you will, as there are less variables to consider. And this is both its failing and its success in comparison to VF.

It's funny that SF inadvertently introduced VF's sabaki with the Focus Attack.

Fulaani:
Viper's still the most awesome character in the game. If I can get through the massive input barrier playing with her presents I'd probably be there in an instant. With my current abilities its impossible to play her to any reasonable level.

Aside:
Apparently Sirlin is not really happy with the game.

Ogi:
You on PSN under Ogikage?

 

With me it's just the opposite, I love watching a good SF bout (except for ST matches /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif ). I just fall asleep while playing, hahaha.

I like all the options VF presents, since it enables me to adapt to my opponent in several ways. There's often a multitude of options to overcome a certain tactic. This, to me, is what makes Virtua Fighter so exciting: 'What will my opponent do next? Evade, fuzzy, guard, abare, sabaki? How will I deal with these things?'.

Street Fighter just feels so limited in comparison.. now, I can live with that, but there's a lot of other things I don't like beside that, with most of them just being general 2d things, I guess, hahaha.

It would be nice to see some of those hardcore SF players try VF some day. I saw some players go really indepth and I just can't help but feel they'd really enjoy VF if they'd put some time into it.. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif .

 

I'm also trying my hand at SF4. My suckage level is still high and can't play this game on a stick at all (yay hori pad)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"There's often a multitude of options to overcome a certain tactic. This, to me, is what makes Virtua Fighter so exciting: 'What will my opponent do next? Evade, fuzzy, guard, abare, sabaki? How will I deal with these things?'. </div></div>
This is what makes VF so hard for me "Oh shit my opponent is playing a character I hardly know because I didn't do my homework! Oshit he's doing a string i've hardly seen before, what shall I do out of these 20 options? Eeeeh... evade? Oh, wrong side, apparantly its a half circ. Guess i'll block next time? Oshi- frame adv on block? Ugh. Fine, so i'm guessing it's a high. I'll duck then. Oh, it's 0-10 already?"

As Vortigar said, <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But in the same vein it is exactly that narrowness of purpose that I also find enticing about the game. In limiting the options a much less cluttered playfield is created. A purer struggle if you will, as there are less variables to consider. And this is both its failing and its success in comparison to VF.</div></div>
I'm kinda digging the simpleness of it all. Though this might start to bore me later. The execution barrier is still pretty high though.

 

For me the simpleness is something that is only skindeep. SF is all about how/where/when you hit your opponent: do your jump in attack to early and you get punished, too late and you get attacked out of it. crouching mk xx fireball with the tip of your toes? doesn't combo..

I think this is something you can only learn/see/feel from playing a lot. Without this feeling you get outplayed all the time and your options start to feel simple and few.

I laughed a bit at your post spoon. I think if you experience higher level play on SF you'll be begging for a framechart that'll tell you what your options are because nearly all the time you get totally run over in this game you'll have nothing to fall back on at all.