Things I hate about this game

Re: IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

AM2 is watching. They are getting feedback from the fans of the game. Lots of them. Each incarnation of Virtua Fighter astounds vis-a-vis the last considerably. I'm sure VF5 (if and when we see it) will be no different & not a little bit of all this is due to AM2's toil and play as well as the toil and play of the players themselves. A voice is good to use, I agree & additionally I like the idea of this thread...good job. I'm a smartass occasionally & if I pissed you off it's probably because I HATE WOLF. We should play sometime so maybe I can hate wolf more (not possible) or you can start hating Akira. Evo2K3 would be nice...

My only point is...it will be fair as well. No one will get robbed of shit. The absolutely "perfect" & "fair" game has not been invented. That's why it's called a game. Games are mirrors of life in a way & even the best of these passes with something missing, something not done, some misfortune. No matter how much prayer went on.

Bitch away to add your voice to make the game better. I can't argue with your passion about this, I just don't think that "fairness" is the issue when something happens that doesn't look right.

Often in endgames featuring just kings & pawns & opposing bishops which run on different color squares the side with even a 2 or 3 pawn deficit can save the draw.

 

Re: IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

Well I am not going to Evo2k3. And I don't think you are an asshole everybody who plays Virtua fighter is a frustrated tight ass because this game doesn't get the respect it deserves. After all the greates game of all times is Eternal Champions(just kidding).

And you should stop making excuses for the games fall backs becasue not even the people who make the game do that. It will take a long time to perfect collision detection and I know they are trying their best.
You can tell they tried their best because in comparisson to other games this has the fewest glitches. And I do think there are games with perfect rules and fairness, but when it comes to fighting games, things get a bit more complicated to reach refinement. Russian Roulette is a fair game, and so is Wheel of fortune.

 

Dude, some moves ARE meant to track. Look at the command list on VFDC. There's a separate column for whether the move tracks and if so, in which direction(s). It's called the Escape/Evade column. The f's mean the move can be dodged to the Front (but if you try to dodge to the opponent's back, it tracks). The b means it can be dodged to the opponent's Back (if you dodge to the front, it tracks). The X means it can't be dodged at all.

Moves that track in one direction are called half circular, moves that track in both directions are called full circular or just circular.

The game designers assigned a tracking property to each move, based on common sense. A typical heelkick always is dodged to the back... look up lau, pai, kage's heelkick. That's because the foot sweeps from the front of your body to the back. Moves like kage's slap are dodged to the front... because he's swinging towards his chest, and you always want to move in the direction of the swing. Foot sweeps tend to travel in a complete half circle and stepping to the left or right won't prevent their leg from encountering your ankle. Hence most sweeps are fully circular.

Anyway, I thought you were talking about the weird tracking properties of some moves which are "technically" linear, but the character will turn around in the middle of the attack to face you. Circular attacks smacking dodges is common knowledge, they're meant to be an alternative to stopping an opponent from dodging too much.

 

Re: IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

I sometimes think the camera angle gets messed up. Like when I do the throw move out of Vanessa's auto punch hold, sometimes the camera sways to the opposite I think it will go and then input the opposite direction for the down attack. As far as I know the camera sway is an unnecessary graphical effect that can interfere with the game

 

Re: IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

Two situations that are not handled very well by the camera imho -

after wolf's GS, it can be a pain to perfect roll the extra damage since you're JUST outside of the camera's scope. It's not that bad though since you eventually learn to do it by timing alone, it's just weird when you are first learning to tech it.

But this next one is just TOO annoying. When you do wolf's hcb++,+, then to the pick up n shove ground throw, the side the camera adjusts to is COMPLETELY RANDOM! I've tried to figure out what circumstances effect which way it spins, but ive haven't had much luck, though I'm pretty sure it's somehow based on the alignment of the stars when you hit + after the throw.

 

Re: IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

[ QUOTE ]
Dandy_J said:

Two situations that are not handled very well by the camera imho -

after wolf's GS, it can be a pain to perfect roll the extra damage since you're JUST outside of the camera's scope. It's not that bad though since you eventually learn to do it by timing alone, it's just weird when you are first learning to tech it.

But this next one is just TOO annoying. When you do wolf's hcb++,+, then to the pick up n shove ground throw, the side the camera adjusts to is COMPLETELY RANDOM! I've tried to figure out what circumstances effect which way it spins, but ive haven't had much luck, though I'm pretty sure it's somehow based on the alignment of the stars when you hit + after the throw.

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OMG your so right I fucking hate when this happens!

Though I know that he camera position is not random, it might as well be, it has something to do with stance before and after the throw, and the angle of approach on your oppoents back.

The camera also switches on Jacky's side throw which forces you to buffer in a down attack or delay it until the camera has stopped.

 

Re: IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

I don't know if there's a systematic way to tell, but knowing which perspective the camera takes is just a matter of experience. I had a tough time too when I picked up Wolf, but now it never messes me up. Unfortunately I can't explain why...just intuition from experience I guess.

 

Re: IT'S NOT FAIR!!!!

It is some what of intuition, but what happens is you begin to recognize patterns in the motions of the direction of the camera. When the camera pans in a clockwise rotation, you will "sense" which direction you need to enter the command in, same for counter clockwise. While some people are better at doing it than others (MukkiAkira is unbelievably amazing at this, so is Arashi).


One example (another Wolf one), is match between Gorilla Kageske and Lau(Punch the Sempu?). Where Gkage uses the shoulder ram, and counters Lau in the middle of a jumping attack, and they switch screen positions, because the G-boys player did not expect the sudden change, he flops up the combo, (this same situation occurs for LeiFei's arrow punch at full charge).

Jesus, I am making posts at 2 in the morning.. /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

What am I, some stupid VF fan boy. Hell no! I know some moves track. I am talking about collision detection. And I am sorry for some of you to hear this for your perfect game, but this game does have some collision problems. Geez, talk about shooting the messenger for no reason. And I have been playing VF since it was in a crappy ass park back in the early 90's. So I know which moves track and don't track. ANd I didn't need to look at some ones list to see what should track and what shouldn't. I knew VF rules for each individual game before it even got a portion of recognition in the States. So stop critisizing my knowledge of the game and see the glitches for your self.

 

sorry, I got the wrong impression from I don't buy that move is suppose to track stuff. Obviously it isn't supposed to hit you if you dodge a move.

And for the record I wasn't shooting you /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif
I can't tell immediately where someone is at VF-wise by their posts. Obviously it was nothing personal.

I find a few moves to have BS hit detection but not enough to bother me. The big one is lei's arrow punch, and outside of that I can't think of any that turn the course of the match or really irritate me.

 

[ QUOTE ]
CreeD said:

I find a few moves to have BS hit detection but not enough to bother me. The big one is lei's arrow punch, and outside of that I can't think of any that turn the course of the match or really irritate me.



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lol, This doesn't have as much to do with tracking, as much as it does with collision detection. Most charging attacks don't "track" like this one, or cover such a huge distance besides.

A comparison is Akira's b,f+p+k this move is evadable, but only on one side (right?), if you simply backdash away, this move won't contact. But that is not the case for the arrow punch.

First the animation for the arrow punch is a hell of alot of frames, more frames than an evade (and some evade attacks). That means that if you evade right at the start (the exact start) then you might 'evade' the attack, but it will catch you off to the side.

The trick to avoiding this attack is to delay the evade input commands, or like some players, just plain out block and struggle.

Heruru has most of his matches with a (from d+p+k+g) p+k FC, when he faces against some people they evade, but most play it safe and choose to block. Struggling out of the hit is not all too hard, though most Lei players tend to use a pp,k+g or pp,p type variant. Watch the quad and semifinals of KSII with Heruru and he does the arrow punch in them.

There are tons of LeiFei matches floating around, where the arrow punch will often decide a round, or some times even a match /versus/images/graemlins/smirk.gif. One of the Netrom vids had this (Lei vs Akira on Lau's stage).

While some might consider the move "cheap," no charging attack is really that hard not to counter when it has such a large frame disadvantage like Lei's (when you are close to him), but from a long range, just don't duck /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif.

I think the reason that we see so much arrow punch abuse is because most of LeiFei's air combos and throws put a good distance between him and the opponent, not to mention you can just dance backwards from your opponent.

This creates an opportunity to charge the arrow punch to the max, and force the opponent to deal with it, sometimes as soon as they recover or stand back up.

While the hit properties are questionable, the move is sill a legit move to use once per match imo, but when it clips someone that 'evaded' it /versus/images/graemlins/mad.gif grrr.......................

 

Thus spake Cat Sandwich.

Cower in fear, for he knows all.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Plague said:

Thus spake Cat Sandwich.

Cower in fear, for he knows all.

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If you are gonna post stuff like this, at least try to contribute to the actual mature discussion that other members are trying to have here.

If you want to post stupid crap like this, post it on another board, or send around some private messages. My picture has absolutely NOTHING to do with Virtua Fighter at all. Therefore I don't think it belongs on this board.

Start a thread like "Catsandwitch", or "empnovacat", but please don't spam after my messages, that is just immature and not necessary.

I got the cat pick here anyways......sigh..... /versus/images/graemlins/confused.gif

PS, if the admins want to, they can get rid of our posts here, and move them to another topic. I like this topic and don't want it cluttered with discussions about my icon.

Thanks-

-Empnova

 

Where would we be without Cat Sandwich?

[ QUOTE ]
Cat Sandwich said:

My picture has absolutely NOTHING to do with Virtua Fighter at all. Therefore I don't think it belongs on this board.

[/ QUOTE ]

rofl

(I'm not sure if your posts have much to do with Virtua Fighter at all, either)

Seriously, haven't you been banned 1,436 times?


Re: Hit detection... I've noticed that quite a few instances of bizarre looking hit detection are repeatable. At least it's somewhat predictable.

 

Ok, I will remember this post when you bitch about my shun rolling punch and his kk /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

I never had a problem with the hit detection of those moves... pay attention!!#@!

 

I've noticed(IIRC) that sometimes when a charge move is evaded (specifically Lei's arrow & Akira's...what is it...DFS +...Lau's +) a fully charged move will connect when the evade happens early. Perhaps this is due to the player pressing after the MC evade. I don't know. I've found that if you get that early MC evade, often you will get a second MC evade sound when you evade again (in the same direction). Makes sense kinda, when you think about it. Fully charged moves force you to perform,. rather than guess...sometimes realizing this is not forthcoming, especially in certain match situations...Like when you are getting OWNED!

 

It is 100,000,000 times harder to talk about weird hit

detection in VF4 evo than in Tekken 4. VF4 has the

most reasonable hit detection among all the fighting

games out there.

 

I wouldnt say that with 100 percent conviction. My tekken friends complain that VF moves do not look like they should hit where they do, and I know a lot of VF heads think the same about TEkken.

 

The only thing is that Tekken has the worse collision detection I have ever seen on a constant bases.