I think it's because the concept of "hard" for any given player is going to differ wildly. The "hard" aspects of VF are not execution (there are obviously a few things that are pretty tough, but by and large the buffer windows are quite forgiving), the hard aspects are: character knowledge (compare the number of moves, options, and frame data for a 2D to a 3D character), which requires one to spend more time 'studying' the game (true of all 3D fighters, Tekken, SC, DoA, etc.); and thinking. I've always seen VF as a game that was designed to maximize the number of choices a player is forced to make, and that those choices should have consequences.

Street Fighter is "hard" in the sense that one frame links are a pain in the ass, but getting that into your muscle memory isn't the hardest thing in the world, and doesn't require a lot of active thinking. It is also, I should add, a really shitty barrier to entry for higher level play. One frame links don't add anything close to "fun" to a gameplay experience, and in my mind are exactly how not to design a good game. VF is "hard" in the sense that there is more in the game to know, so it requires more encyclopaedic understanding, and that decisions are highly emphasized.

For my money, I'd rather play a game where the system gets out of my way (fewer one frame links), and the emphasis is on quality of gameplay, rather than overcoming an execution as a barrier to entry of the 'real game'.

/drops mic

The talk about VF being a hard game, not easy to play, difficult, hard to get into blah, blah, blah, is a two sided coin. Some ppl are attracted to VF because of that reputation. Some ppl are repelled from VF because of that reputation. We can't really lay all of the blame on the author for characterizing VF as a no-pain-no-gain proposition. This site and its community does just as much to perpetuate that whole secret-society-advantage-disadvantage-sabaki-throw-escape-fuzzy-guard-frame-analytical-OM-DM-inashi-whiff-better-spend-more-time-in-the-dojo-tech-roll-dont-poke-the-turtle if you want to be good at VF thing as the article ever could.

Of course the author is going to say VF is not for the weak of heart, if the article characterized VF any other way the he would risk facing the rage and condemnation of lots of VFers at VFDC.

I have found that often when ppl characterize VF as hard to get into, what they really are referring to is the fact that it is so bare bones. There's not a whole bunch there for the casual player. Usually the criticism is not really aimed at the fighting engine or controller mechanics required, but really just refer to VF's lack of features that the novice or casual fight gamer expects to find or would find in any other fighting game.

VF is an acquired taste. That fact is not likely to change.

they should add ex moves!!!

*waits for angry mob*

shoryukens don't kill blocking. in fact they're really bad if you block them. fadc upper is another matter that is stupid, but they're at least -5 on block now

yeah, but you misunderstand why it is what you claim.

I never quite understood your attitude towards people who actually learn game mechanics. Not like that stuff isn't in the game for a reason.
Tell me what fighting game community does not discuss frames, strategies and mechanics?

I'll just say that if an idiot like me could learn this game and be OK in it, anybody else can too. Not that hard once you put some work into it, but not as easy as Mash Shoryuken Get To 3000BP Fighter 4.

I think you meant PP, and no one's getting 3000 PP by mashing DP. just no lol. There are ways to deal with DP, and other options at the same time.

I dont know about that secret society mess. One or two opinions don't really matter. No one can put your shoes on for you, but you wanna be sure you can run laps with everyone. How you equip yourself is completely your own decision. There are people here that lose constantly because they are ignorant to their laces being untied. Gotta stay honest.

For VF, the average play level (outside of Japan) is still pretty low. 80% of the time VF (especially FS) is just low execution guesses. Anyone can win.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hp5fQxypkSY

Those guys were 2k pp... A good player would have annihilated that guy who barely won anyways.

They were both at 3k BP which is more important than PP, BLACKHAWKxDOWN is legendary for his uppercut mashing and he probably has about 2 billion PP on his Ken. The point was that due to SF4 being so popular, there is at least 5 BLACKHAWKxDOWNs for every good player, which means players like this will face each other, win, get points and move up in rank to surprisingly high at least until they hit the point where only really good players play, but it still doesn't matter because there still will be other shitty players to play against.

LOL, I'm one of those ppl who learn the game mechanics. Its one thing to learn them, appreciate them, and use them. Its another thing to beat ppl over the head with them, or shun casual players that either don't have the time or choose not to learn them.

Sometimes in our zealous passion for VF we can turn ppl off, ppl that are border line between casual and serious-intermediate or serious-beginner.

I'm not knocking VF. Just suggesting that we be a little wise from time to time

To me personally, the series' guessing game was how it made it fairly good, but I have never liked the idea of the continuous over-exaggeration that Virtua Fighter, this genre, or specific non-fighting games require sort of professional trade level talent in order to comprehend what you are getting into. They are merely video games. Any game can become challenging if you intentionally or unintentionally, search for the right person. I understand that how hard a game is to learn to the people is subjective, because people's learning speed aren't the same.

Anyway, the performance of Virtua Fighter commands are easy to me, because from a difference, 3d fighting games always had it looser in that category than 2d fighting games. Capcom, SNK, Ark Systems (any Guilty Gear similarity honestly) games of command execution and even more-so Weaponlord were more moderate to learn.

Though for an add-on compliment to this game is customization, because I never liked bland designs as a person said here. That's a plus.

Well, there are ppl who are just talented for this kind of game and pick everything without a whole bunch of struggle. On the other hand I know cats who have struggled with VF and still don't quite get it, and a whole bunch ppl in between.

There are some cats that have taken VF to the stratosphere and play at a crazy high level with crazy deep knowledge of the game, there are some guys that have deep knowledge of the game but can't play for crap. Then again I know several cats that are very good at VF and don't know any of the technical details of the game like frames, advantage, disavantage, etc, etc. They just find winning strategies and use them. If you ask them to explain why they work, these dudes couldn't begin to tell you LOL and that's kewl to.

In reality its all relative. I would just like to see our community welcome everybody no matter what level they play at. Most of us do that. But we have a few knuckle heads who are out of control from time to time.

As they say in the porno field: 'one man's soft is another man's hard'

The problem is that things like failed evade dash cancel and other hand aerobics option selects exist and have a large effect on the metagame. These are also not intuitive. At high-level play a person needs to be able to use failed evade dash cancels or else it puts the player at a huge disadvantage. Remember MTE?

Yes, I understand, but I wasn't generalizing what you've said from my first sentence, if that's what you have directed your reply to? The degree of rock-paper-scissors aspect was what I was complimenting on from it's defensive fundamental system, being a solution to avoid many attacks. It kind of reminds me of SF3 parry system and Weaponlord's system (defending against all attacks). They made things a little less straight forward from those games, to me at least, but like I said, it isn't to be exaggerated. Yes I remember those multiple throw escapes. I didn't agree with removing them, because I never saw need to downgrade any of the gameplay mechanics.

Edited: Confused.

Which again underlines the main (pretty faulty) argument that VF is somehow especially hard to get into or enjoy than the rest. The inputs are often easier, there are only a few hard-to-exe techs and it's basic system is simple enough, without being simplistic. Only the guesses are hard and they should anyway be exactly that. Instead of exacerbating the toughness myth, VF players should shoot those down at every chance to do so.

I only played Vanilla a little, but immediatedly perceived FS as more flashy, n00b friendly and infinitely more combo happy. Adding those wonderful costumes made it even mode approachable. It pains me to note that many offshore (but also inland) people are talking about present VF in terms of outdated historical (un)relevance.

hmmm..... "VF in terms of outdated historical (un)relevance".... well it might not just be VF that gets this treatment. It remains to be seen where the fighting games even fit in the PS4 and Xbone generation. Will we another generation of fighting games in 2015? 2016? or have we already seen the last hurrah..... with cell phone games winning the day

That's good to know, I don't really play GGX, or MKX or KOf (much) . I've done my share of MK and just flirted with KOF, but those are all 2D games right? At least they were when I played them. Is it that the 2D games are easier for the game developers to make for the new consoles, and the 3D game developers are still dealing with a learning curve?

I haven't heard anything about:

VF
Tekken
SC
DOA
Bloody Roar
Deadliest Warrior
Def Jam FFNY......

I would consider getting a PS4 if one of these games were to drop. I haven't played games on a PC in a long time. All my systems are Linux or Mac OSX, That would be kewl if the fighting games got released in these environments.

SC recently put out a free to play game. Harada has apparently teased with a new FG, so probably Tekken 7. Then there's the possible Tekken vs SF game. DOA5 ultimate is not old and they are still pushing out content for it. Bloody roar is dead .. Don't even know what the last 2 are.