Ready for a new flame?

SHOU SUCKS~~~

Great post A++ would read again!

 

I think I made it pretty clear that I think you improved tremendously, probably more than any other GTN player. Your reaction time has noticeably improved. You play where a person cant guess whats coming next. Your command input has also greatly improved. You can also see stance combos. You simply need to work on your command input a little more and be confident of your choices. Confidence, meaning belief that a move will hit, this way you are prepared for every follow up that you need. Perhaps you should work in some Backdash, ECD or just Crouchdash back in your game a little to add to your offense.

Your Akira is farther ahead than your Goh and Akira suits you more.

 

Beat Tribe has hundreds, if not thousands, of players involved. There aren't profiles for every single player going to Beat Tribe on the website.

The purpose of a player directory is to showcase all the active players in the NAVF community. This can then tie into regularly scheduled events, since a good portion of the player directory would probably represent the players to watch out for during gatherings and tournaments.

The members in the player directory should also be the ones who are actively contributing funds toward the twice annual events.

If there really were 80 Active NAVF players as Owen guessed and each one regularly contributed $20 to each scheduled event, that would make a budget of $1600. That's more than enough to bring a good event together, including airfare, or maybe 1/2 airfare, for 1 or 2 Japanese players.

If this really happens my $20 will be the first donation that Myke sees toward the twice annual events.

Money + Coordinated Human Resources + Regularly Scheduled Dates + Players = Amazing Events.

I would make time in advance since the schedule would be a regular thing to look forward too. I've noticed that the oldies these days need months in advance to make their scedules free. The younger kids just need events to be around school breaks and vacations for the most part.

The money would be given to the players in the directory of the city hosting the event. Since the events are only twice a year, the host city get's a full 6 months to coordinate an event. The entire city would be held responsible and we would then be able to track whats going on through a thread on VFDC. The events as I mentioned would be rotated among cities to keep things fresh and NAVF growing. Since it still is mainly kids behind the whole thing, I recommend keeping the funds in escrow until the money is needed to purchase airfare or make other arrangements, such as renting out a venue for the event.

 

That's cool...I take everything online with a grain of salt. If in Japan, I would still like to meet up with you and hang with you. As for that dinner thing...man, I don't know what happened you guys just disappeared into the crowd.

I agree with you that it takes talent to get to the next level. But it also takes experience and the best competition, in addition to that talent, to get to the next level. Maybe you got it, and I don't. But take Danny for instance. I have no doubt in my mind that he has what it takes to be the next Inotchi, but he won't be able to get there by playing Zeng Zi and me over and over again here in Singapore.

 

Shou with that compassionate conservative reponse, this flame war is going nowhere. Its not that you lost to andy at ec4.5 its the fact you actually blamed it on TIERS!! Pretty weak EXCUSE for complaining how uncompetitive the socal scene is. Its funny how you read inane comments about my movement, and you dont remember socal competing outside the scene. Maybe you take my comments too seriously as well. . . . OH NOES!!!

check please!!

lets seriously unban, shang. This will keep me entertained at work for days. /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

just for fun

SHOU IS UNWORTHY TO NORITAKA FUNAMIZU OF CAPCOM!!

 

Please stfu with the unban Shang whining already, this thread is one of the best this site has seen in a long time and I wish it to remain a discussion, or work towards that way, instead of 50 random character assasinations for someones amusement.

/KiwE

 

"AFAIK from a conversation with Shou and my observations about Akiralove's approach to the game, an all out winning style, aka boring style, is discouraged in SoCal.

I would say to encourage players these days a happy medium is needed. If a player wants to play, all out boring or all out flashy let it happen so long as they are getting better. It should be upto the stronger players to advise those who are getting stuck in habits or need help improving."

Just wanted to point out that Shou doesn't know shit about me, or my friends. I think a few years ago, I used to try to encourage people to play on a more social, and less hardcore "Must Win!" kind of way. The reason for this, you've made clear yourself:

"The best approach to the game should be one where people are having fun and getting better at the game.

If both criteria are not being met then a person should step back and try their best to match both criteria for the players around them."

I'm suprised that I'm hearing this from you , but I like your new take on things. We have a pretty good mix of players here now, and everyone pretty much plays differently. Joey is an example of someone that plays to kill, every time. But, we have enough people here now that there's always a good variety, and no one really dominates (which usually happens when the same people play with each other a lot). But, whenever I've mentioned fun, I think people get the idea that it means we aren't serious, or don't try to win. The ideas aren't exclusive, and at AI, everyone tries to win pretty much every game. I wrote this in the Socal thread, and it's still true, even more so now that "Grandmaster Flash(play)" DRE has arrived: wild, exciting play with lots of bold moves gets everyone pumped up more than win streaks. The "Ooohhs" and clapping hands speak for themselves.

Getting back to what you said, I've always thought that if someone isn't having fun, something's wrong. Too often a crucial part of any social interaction is forgetten in fighting games: caring about how other people feel. You're right, if less experienced people in a crew are discouraged by being shut out all the time, they should be given advice, and IMO, a chance. A chance to play as much as everyone else, a chance to enjoy themselves, a chance to learn. All the coaching in the world doesn't do any good if you only get 3 rounds on a machine before you have to wait 20 minutes to play again. Fighting games are competitive, but I think they work best in the context of human interaction if the Social aspect is focused on more than the Competitive aspect.

It's sad to say, but I've actually seen the competitive side of fighting games totally ruin relationships between people who would otherwise have been friends.

For Example: Shou.

Andy, if you're being sincere here, I think you're saying you're learned that there's a difference between talking shit with the homies, in person; and talking shit online (essentially behind people's backs, because you can't assume people will always read what you've written), to people who aren't your friends, or who you once thought were friends. Online, in written text that carries no tone, and often no context, little insults can seem very rude and hurtfull. Especially when people don't ASK or DESERVE to be put in the position of being insulted on multiple levels, the way Shou is insulting my friends here in Socal.

Thing is, sometimes people MEAN them this way, and they hide behind the safety of the net. When they see you in person, they smile, acting like it's all a joke (and sometimes it is). But when it isn't, when it's meant seriously, then people try to cop the "hey, it's just the net, man" attitude, those people are chicken-shit bitches, with no balls and no integrity. To me, these kind of shit-talkers just ruin the scene for everyone, and for people coming in. No one should have to feel be-rated because they don't want to put more time into playing a fucking video game than feels natural to them. If you want to practice every day, you should give the same ammount of respect to someone that just wants to play now and then. Just like anyone, they're playing the game because it seems like fun to them. The idea that people want to shit on others for not slaving away in Training or Quest Mode for hundreds of hours is bullshit.

So, I just wanted to say to the homies in Socal (and anywhere else who cares, really): Just ignore Shou. He's once again shown that he has no class, by insulting all of us, including those of us who have invited him into our homes time and time again (Talis, Hat Brian, and myself) in the most friendly manner possible.

He's made it obvious that he doesn't care about remaining friends with any of us, and that he thinks he's somehow better than us, by saying we aren't competitive, have no drive etc. He may try to do crawdad up, saying in later posts that it's all aimed at Alex, and it's all a joke etc; but those are just his bullshit ways of trying to cover his ass. He means all those insults, stupid as it is; then suggests that other people have issues if they listen to them.

I was the first to open my home to Shou (back when us "oldies" were playing VF3, and he didn't play VF), so I feel like because of my hospitality he came to know us, so he could act like our friend then shit all over us. I'm sorry that we ever met him, and that you guys have to have a real piece of garbage like him in your life. I don't really care what Eric thinks about me, I know who I am and I don't place the value of who I am in my skill at VF. But I can't stand it when he insults you guys.

Shou: Alex's point in mentioning EC4.5 (I think that was actually EC5) was in response to your questions about "When were you guys competitive?".

It's been pointed out before, but since you're ignorant and have a short memory, here goes again:

E3 tourney at my house: you loose, to Socal players

EC4.5 (at Burbank Game shop): you loose, to Socal players

little E3 casual tournament in Hat Brian's backyard: you loose, to Socal players

EC5: You loose, to Socal player Andy

That's when we were competitive; or, at least competitive enough to own your ass, over and over: for most of the timeline of VF4. So that makes the score what, 4 to 1?

Now you're gonna come out with all the "well, I used to suck" garbage. So tourneys where YOU do well are all that matters? It's exactly the same as how you just talked shit about Jeff, who points out that he actually DID beat you, then here come the bullshit excuses again ("I was getting used to FT"). Jeff doesn't need excuses. Then you change the subject, to some other insult about how Jeff'd hit a ceiling if he came to Japan, but it's all in good fun anyway.

Ever since Evo2k4 you've puffed up your chest like you're the man, but even though you did beat LA Andy, guess what?

YOU LOST, BITCH!

I've never seen someone suck their own dick so much for getting 2nd place.

Just like you LOST in the little rinky-dink Japanese tourneys that you linked to in the media section, to unknown players, most of whom were in the 6th to 10th dan range.

YOU LOST!

Then you're gonna pipe up about how you're suddenly one of the best Sarah's in Japan? Nigga PLEEEEEAAAAAASSSEEEE! Is that because everyone quit already? You are no Muscle Sarah, Anii or K-2. Those guys whould have had a Bar-B-Q with that little tourney you played in.

What you ARE is an insecure bitch who needs a video game to feel good about himself. I'm full of shit? Then why do you own 300 arcade boards that you brag to people from Japan about (in front of me), post pictures of all your consoles and VF4 arcade CDs etc? Then once you realized that people don't really give a shit about all that junk, you decide to become a "winner". But Eric, you haven't won SHIT.

And you're too dumb to realize that you've really lost: respect and friendship from people who once gave it willingly. But hey, you've got all your new friends, right? And those hordes of bitches lined up around the block you keep mentioning (because you're insecure in your boyhood). Why keep insisting that VF ISN'T your life and that you DIDN'T move to Japan for VF? No one else is talking about that... maybe that's what YOU think?

Anyway, I've wasted too much time and space in Andy's thread. If you ever see me, here or in Tokyo where I work from time to time, I'd suggest staying away from me. Now put your own dick back in your mouth and leave people on VFDC alone, anyone can sling shit at unsuspecting people from afar, you chicken-shit motherfucker.

Bryan

 

wow, that was pretty good, I was wondering when you would post so let's fight for real when you come here next, k? You are more than welcome to fight me over this if you feel compelled to. As for the other SoCal ppl, I'm sure they can stand up for themselves like Talis and Alex here if they feel insulted. I am flattered that you keep track of my posts since Evo2K4, I have hardly posted, mostly just to correspond with visitors. Obviously even before all of this, you've held these feelings back. You never liked the other area's approach and style in the game. You hate how Adam plays. I am sure you detest my "5 move" Sarah too. As for the players you mentioned, Muscles cant get past 8 dan, K-2 fights me regularly for ranking and is known widely as chicken here, Anii went even with me last time we played, 5-5, but he pretty much retired after having a kid. That tourney in Mizue, I didn't link to it and I lost to a Chishou Jacky (Katou Taka vs Maguro something is his regular ringname) who was in the SBO finals on Mukki's team as well as a KS finalist.

You can call this chicken shit internet talk or whatever but if one person takes it as inspiration to get better than it is does its job. Pampering new players doesn't work. They get too accustomed to having everything handed to them. It's just like a spoiled child. Once everything is taken away, they usually can't do it on their own. The NYC vets worked hard to give their new gen a scene, what is going to happen when the vets are no longer there? To me, most of the new blood doesn't have the same level of dedication and can't keep it going. As for incest playing or stagnation, players can move beyond that if they really want to get better. Maddy is a perfect example. Why is he #1 in his scene? They all started around the same time. It isn't some miracle, he put the effort in. I mean what I say if you can understand it. I want players to want to improve and get to the level where VF is really enjoyable. You can argue about how good or not I am but you can't deny I played VF in an area with very few players, none near my level. Yah, I sucked a lot before, I lost to everyone here before I am sure but I wanted to get better and I got there. I didn't win shit but I accomplished what many of us wanted to do but you guys wouldn't know what went on outside of your scene, how old rivals banded together and supported each other, how we reached out to the KR and JP scenes to bring players over. Your scene is closed, isolated away. Yeah, you guys went to TiT once, out of how many gatherings, which wasn't even a main VF gathering. You and whoever can keep on thinking I am attacking your character if you want, the only thing I am questioning here is how hardcore some of you believe you are. For some reason, it is really only Americans who take insult to this. If you are casual, then why care? If you are hardcore, then you can prove me wrong by your play. Pretty simple.

I am an asshole on here nowadays b/c the old ways don't work. So come kick my ass in the game, if you want to do it IRL, that's fine too. It is what it is, a game, one that is competitive. You make it out to be as much as you want it to be.

Bryan, like I said a year earlier, I'd still welcome you to stay in my home. Andy flames me all of the time, we get along fine. Shang secretly loves me.

 

"wow, that was pretty good, I was wondering when you would post so let's fight for real when you come here next, k?"

"Bryan, like I said a year earlier, I'd still welcome you to stay in my home."

/me head explodes.

I'm getting older. I love VF. I'm getting older.

----------------------

"Whoah, I didn't know you could do that... what's it called again? 'Iai kick?' "

"Hey! you must be ______ on vfdc! Thanks for stopping by my house. *later* "Hehe, you mean all the guys in NYC play with the index finger on guard?... weird"

"Heh, sure I'll try some Cappo pai. *later* "Ugh, that kid's sick."

"Meathead Jacky... LOL"

"I feel helpless :/ ..... and THOSE are were some ugly teeth."

"Stupid VF2 Kage. James is pretty funny... "

"Hmmm, let's see if I can squeeze a couple of nights of EVO2k4 before blackout period at work."

"OH SWEET! I still have sky miles! *checking flights* Oh COOL! Ohio here I come!"

"Yeah, FT is a little slower isn't it? Too bad we don't have this game in Boston. Rod lemme see your PSP again.... "

----------------------

I'm getting older. I love VF. I'm getting older.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Shou said:

You can call this chicken shit internet talk or whatever but if one person takes it as inspiration to get better than it is does its job. Pampering new players doesn't work.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like this at all. I don't think it's worth the trade. One new strong player who's motivated by abuse in trade for X numbers of players discouraged by abuse is not how I like things to be. I don't like that you're promoting it here. I don't operate that way and I don't want other people to, either.

Please stop.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Plague said:

[ QUOTE ]
Shou said:

You can call this chicken shit internet talk or whatever but if one person takes it as inspiration to get better than it is does its job. Pampering new players doesn't work.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like this at all. I don't think it's worth the trade. One new strong player who's motivated by abuse in trade for X numbers of players discouraged by abuse is not how I like things to be. I don't like that you're promoting it here. I don't operate that way and I don't want other people to, either.

Please stop.

[/ QUOTE ]

we can come up with every reason why the VF scene is so small but I think the answer is clear: a great number of the players are assholes. small wonder.

I miss the days that were both old and good.

GE

 

[ QUOTE ]

If you really are playing this game, I don't understand why you wouldn't put the effort in it to get good if you are going spend time doing it. Why do anything and half ass it?

I learned this game from reading the mooks and 1/60 while going to gatherings and tourneys. I learned how and when to use the defensive techniques, how to see stance, how to punish whiffs, etc, all from reading, practicing and doing. So, have others.



[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
For those of you who have the misconception that I am promoting VF = life, it is very far from the truth. I didn't move to Japan to play VF, nor did I dedicate my whole life to it before. lol


[/ QUOTE ]

I cant believe you of all people said vf does not = life
I mean seriously, you own a liscense plate that says VIRTUA on it. Also stop talking about retired people, like an accomplishment, you start to sound like ICE-9.

Speaking of shit talking, I remember shang beat you in the PRIDE (formerly money match) at evo . . . . .oooooh shou got . . . .ummmm MODED!!

oh btw Im also flattered that you like to read my posts in the socal jamboree thread /versus/images/graemlins/blush.gif

oh Kiwe - with love from Pushku
"Kiwe is lame, hes just a retarded fruit."
Seriously have you noticed that you're the only person that has a problem with shang, and then bitches to everyone through PM's.

Remember this is all just for fun, OOGLY BOOGLY!! work is boring. . .

 

[ QUOTE ]
Shou said:
<u>INTERNET: SERIOUS BUSINESS</u>
you are pretty stupid if you take what i say on the internet seroisly LAFF)O


[/ QUOTE ]

and Dandy_J fuck you for posting that catchphrase before me!

 

Man lets get back on topic. How about a player profile system with contributions toward twice a year events.

I'll even spring for a domain, www.navf.net, and pay for server space if someone could code up something simple that mocks the functions of the Beat Tribe website, unless Myke would like to take it upon himself to make a section dedicated to the system and events.

 

Crew: I am in. that sounds like a great idea.

 

i'll spring for some hot pictures of women /versus/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

I just want to add something to the original discussion.

It's not a very positive response if you want to know.

After I first read Andy's post, I just thought that the idea simply won't work. A VFR-like webpage is useless if no one plays the game.... Granted, this may work well in areas where alot of people play like Socal or NYC; but pretty much any where else in the US, it really wouldn't promote anything. VFR is where it is today because of the popularity of the game, and not the other way around. There simply is no real way of attracting people to play this game and dedicate all the time and effort required to be "good" at it. One of the things that Shou is right about is that the people who are good at VF in Japan really ARE the dregs of society, that is what it takes. You can't look for talent in new players, it's simply not something you can expect from people, you just have to bet on them spending time to play it. Which is something that takes alot of love and dedication for the game.

That "love" is something that I, as someone who is one of the described, believe to be a positive thing to have, something that's worth me spending hours studying the game and such. That "love", however, is not something that can be seen in the same light by someone who is not already inclined to have such "love". By that, I mean new players....

Take for example, last time I went to Cali... I really really hoped that I could have played alot more.... I had waited a long long time to be able to play different kinds of new styles and people. It really fired me up that I was having a hard time winning in CA, since I'm so used to playing a certain way against the locals who are not as good. The reason that I wasn't able to stay as long was because I had brought my gf for undisclosed reasons, and she did not understand such "love" for the game. This just goes to show you that the average person won't care about some game or some website. They are not going to magically convert just because they see people playing this game on a web site.

The second thing I want to say is that US is simply too big and too expensive to travel for VF. You simply can not get good by playing people from different states every once in a while. Look at where the good players come from. Everywhere they only come out from where a good sized scene is located. Ohio, Fl, NYC, CA, etc... You don't see people coming out from the smaller scenes without dedicated players.... Back to my CA example. When I first started playing the other players, I couldn't adjust fast enough to the way everyone played. It was just so different than what I'm used to, on top of practically non existent character experiences. I'm sure CA players would laugh at some of the stuff I was falling for, but the point is that you simply need a decent sized scene with alot of variety to get good at this game. My main sparring partner is a Goh player, so when I play against Goh, I'm perfectly comfortable and and do well, but when it comes to Lei Fei or Sarah, it's like all the tricks are unknown to me. It's too bad that I had to leave so early, since I was just starting to become comfortable playing against such a foreign variety. It's just too bad that some locations are simply better breeding grounds for high level VF play, and not many of them exist in the US. The key to getting more players is not a website, the key is feeding the hunger of the people who are inclined to have this "love" for the game, at the right time and at the right place, and that unfortunately is still in the arcades. Only those who frequent the arcades would have the time and motivation to spend their time at a game. Normal casual game players simply won't fit the bill. So the key to getting new players is just to get VF units into the arcades. That is where people should focus their effort. Once we have a scene like Tekken or Soul Calibur, then it's probably a good idea at that time for something like this.... just look the history of tekkenzaibatsu...

With VF5 coming, everyone should bug Sega or their local arcades to get VF5. It will come at a time when there's the hunger for new fighting games. You can argue the arcades are dead in the US, but that is where you will find the next best player to this game.

 

[ QUOTE ]
the key is feeding the hunger of the people who are inclined to have this "love" for the game, at the right time and at the right place, and that unfortunately is still in the arcades.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well I'm not sure if you understood me correctly. Beat Tribe caters to all the active competative VF'ers in Japan not the average casual player. The player profile system would cater to the 80, if Owens estimate is correct, active NAVF players. The major benefit is to raise money and coordinate regularly scheduled events. How much better would it be if we set a budget and had dates everyone could look forward too.

Do you believe it would have little benefit to NAVF to have 2x a year events? Do you think it would be next to useless to have a website that arranges the events and profiles the players involved in the events?

I think its a great step forward. Remember NYC organizing an event is just NYC. Ohio is just Ohio. LA is just LA. Cycle the events and actually give people a budget to work with and now we have built a real NAVF scene. Remeber those 80 players have the love you're talking about and it's that scene that would care about a system like this.

Who cares if we don't have a scene as large as Tekken or Soul Calibur. What better way to feed our scene that by having events? By showing people that we are organized, even though we are a small group, we are sending out a strong message to interested players who attend. By profiling the players we are showing how tightly knit we are as a group. I can't think of a better way to grow the NAVF community either.

The arcade scene wont be revived in NA due to VF5. It's time for us to rely on other methods to bring VF to NA.

This type of system could be built into a thread on VFDC but my fear is that there would be too much noise without Myke locking it. If this can be done as a thread then lets try it out.

Remember a well coordinated event, that has a budget, with 1/2 a year advance notice and we could bring the FT kits, VF5 kits, XBOX 360's or PS3's for other people to play at these events.

Thats the message I got from Beat Tribe. No matter how large the event, you felt like you were part of something special. I'd like to make something special for those active players beyond what we have on VFDC already.

So Myke, or someone who has the skills to do this, will you step up and help make this system possible for NAVF?

We have $40 in donations already, Stomp and I, toward the first event.

 

just to add something:

I think that like Srider said, the main problem of VF in the US is lack of an audience, and Arcade popularity is the only real thing that would kindle this (or online play, DOAU's got a pretty huge audience, almost all of whom started taking the game seriously as soon as it went online from what I can tell).

Americans just don't like VF... Japanese like VF much more than Tekken, SC, SF etc. what can you do?

I think some of the ideas here are a step in the right direction, but there's one thing other fighting game scenes do that VF heads have never gotten into, and IMO it'd start to help:

Invite other games to VF events.

The Tekken and SF communities have actually been very friendly to the VF scene, with tourneys like TiT, Evo and Electric Cancel all going out of their way to include VF. Play the favor back, and I guarantee that you'll see more people start to dip into VF as another game they play. If you advertise in your community that you're also having T5 at your VF tourney, and it'll be a $ prize from entry fees, a lot more people will show up. If you look to BT as your example, they support all fighting games.

Just my 2 cents.

Bryan