move systems...how they work and why

Well, I was going to make a graceful exit from this thread, but to quickly respond to your post...

re: open and closed doors, you're not being sarcastic I hope. It's how open vs. closed was explained to me when I was learning and I got it instantly, although that could be a fluke. Are you still failing to see it maybe?!

I understand the comparison, but it certainly doesn't seem intuitive to me. That was my point. It just seemed funny to see "parallel" and "eight" criticized as counter-intuitive when the "closed" and "open" is compared to a door. I mean, where the hell is my cat?!

To be honest, I didn't read your addendum about the stance thing, but for the Jacky example I used, it's P,K, not P+K (VF3).

 

oh yah, I'd forgotten all about the P-sidekick vs. P-crescent being which-foot's-forward dependent.

For the intuition argument, you could make a good case that parallel is intuitive... but eight stance definitely is not. Anyway it's a moot point.
Search results for usage of parallel or eight stance on VFDC:
4 results. Two in this thread, the other two made by you in older posts. You are literally the only person on this board to use the terms. And in one of the posts, you wrong "parallel/closed stance" just to be sure we could understand. So for the purposes of informing people on VFDC, you should use open or closed.

That's a guideline, not an order.

 

I really want to meet you... so I can slap you across the face!!! Just cos' you're an 'old hand' doesn't mean you have to act like an old grumpy bastard! Do you honestly believe that foul language adds weight to your arguments. Do you watch Southpark or something - I bet you do, that type of humour seems to be about your level. Go back to the playground with your friends Zippy and George.

 

Well, that's impressive effort for a moot point. I got a lot more results than 4, but I didn't bother combing through all of them to make sure they referred to stances...I don't have that much leisure time, unfortunately.

So for the purposes of informing people on VFDC, you should use open or closed.

Nah.

 

Response to Topic + Thoughts on Stupid Bitching

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Response to Shaolinjman
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Open/Close Stance = Feet Positioning. (As you probably know by now after this simple matter has now become flaming ground). Common usage would call this "stance," but it is almost always referred to with an indicator (open or closed) so it's sort of self-contained and implied.

Special Stances, commonly referred to in other games simply as stance is within the character. It is simply a technique or sequence of techniques that result in the character taking "interesting" properties. I think VF started having these in VF2, pretty much with Shun. VF3 added quite a few as well. Technically, we "could" consider Turned-Around to be a "special stance," but we don't refer to it that way in common language. Jacky may be the only character depending on which foot is forward, and that pretty much just applies to P,K.

The relative position of the two characters (aside from their feet) has never been referred to as a stance for as much as I know. It's relevant, but people usually don't refer to it as a stance.

VF4 is loaded with Special Stances and so I recommend you look them up on the movelists at www.virtuaproject.com. Some simple ones to remember:

Jacky - Shuffle (Step). Some martial arts would call this a defensive setup, but for the sake of the game and language, we just call it "shuffle."

Sarah - Flamingo, commonly referred to as FL.

Kage - Jumonji Stance (do people refer to this as JS?)

Shun - Hand Stand. Not much discussion on Shun, but I plan to work on him in VF4 when I get to play the game on a decent basis. Guess I'm hoping we can say HS and in a listing of moves for a sequence refer to things like df+P, P+K, K, HS (implying the quick transition into HS out of a combo, I'm sure somebody's gonna start using ~ to indicate a stance change, but it probably won't be necessary).

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What I think of this messed up debate
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If my perspective matters to anyone, I think "open" and "closed" are fine.

Parallel makes sense once the context is understood, but eight-stance implies you already know Chinese Characters (hence it didn't make sense to me for like 10 minutes until I started thinking about the character for "hachi" which looks like / \ ). You might as well call it "hachi" stance instead of Eight Stance because so many people think of a visual 8. This is an english forum and we are discussing english verbal/written terms for VF.

I do agree with Rich's argument on common language and this being an english forum. But I do also think he makes himself look like a bigot by "seemingly" targetting Ice-9 constantly. It's not my little war, but that's how I see it. His argument alone was good and good enough for the thread and all that was really needed.

Anyways... I hope this thread stops becoming more and more ridiculous soon. Shaolinjman, good question, I appreciate the curiousity. Don't worry too much abotu this open vs. eight or whatever argument/versus/images/icons/smile.gif

-Chanchai

 

lol, what a cheap tactic - "I may have lost this argument, but you must be one of the idle rich (and be extremely anal-retentive) to waste your time on piddly shit"

Go fuck yourself. You devoted as much time as I did, and the use of my time is mine to judge.

And learn to search competently. Here's a clue that will only take fourteen seconds of your precious limited resources. Search for parallel stance. Then search for eight stance. Then search for 8 stance. You're STILL the only one to use the fucking terms! You can try to be cool and stick to your guns and and refuse to acknowledge the common term, but it makes you look like a snot and will only lead to confusion. You might as well call the AS3 Shoshitsou Fukkou Geki and start looking for other common terms to fuck up for the sake of our 1% japanese readership (who all speak english and can translate the terms anyway).

I'm beginning to see why Rich gets so frustrated with you.
Don't be an asshole just for the sake of winning the argument, it doesn't work.

 

Re: Response to Topic + Thoughts on Stupid Bitching

All of this has been very interesting...been experimenting a little this afternoon, unfortunately work kept me from playing as long as i'd like!

I have a specific Lei question on the tiger stance - does anyone know how to move into it? All of the movelist faq's mention crane crab and scorpion but neglect to say how the tiger stance is setup...

 

Not quite. Hwoarang's stance is independant of his opponent, and it does not matter if the resulting stance is open or closed. The only thing that matters for Hwoarang is which foot he has forward, and that's it.

I didnt really get this reply myke, maybe you can elaborate about the independent thing. His moves do vary though depending on which foot is forward, which is similar to open/closed stance since you have to pay attention to the characters orientation on the screen, its different from vf, where open or closed is absolute with Hworang second player side moves are different from closed stance and 1player side closed stance since its based on foot first. Is this what you meant by independent?

CrewNYC

 

Re: Response to Topic + Thoughts on Stupid Bitching

d+P+K,P
df+P+K,P
uf+P+K,P
f+K
f,f+K+G
(crab) K

All result in Tiger Stance.

 

Re: Response to Topic

merçi beaucoup!