Kakutou Shinseiki 3 Updates

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Maybe there are tiers at the highest level, but quite frankly, at our level, this talk of tiers is a moot point. Because ANY player reading this would lose a deathmatch to ANY copper *insert favorite low-tier character* from Tokyo. So until you get to that elite level, I would suggest thinking about improving your own skills than bitching about what tier your character belongs to.

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lol I think you got it backwards. Tiers only exist for low-mid lvl players, the high lvl copper *insert favorite low-tier character* ranked players always make the harder match ups look so easy cos tiers dont really affect them much anymore.

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To anyone arguing about tiers...just go to Japan. And try to rank up. You will quickly realize that your problems are more about the opposing player's fundamental skill, style match-up, and character match-up than what character the opponent is using. As Jeffry, I hate playing against Lau or Pai. As Kage, I hate playing against Aoi or Sarah.

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I think you can attribute that to lack of experience, more than anything. How many good Sarahs/Aois do you play outside of Japan? I told you this was going to be a problem for you guys, which brings me to my next point.

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Alucard, if you really think Jacky/Lau/Akira needs powering up...just go to Japan. If you really think Kage is all that, play him and kill us all. Hell, just PLAY more. There may not be much of a scene left in Singapore, but you have two Tsuwamonos, and a Zheng Zhi who's probably better than Tsuwamono. Show us how good Kage is.

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I dunno Jeff, but I think I got somewhat sick of fighting Danny's Akira and your Kage long ago, and the game is a lot less interesting for me since I only fight like 3 of the chars 99% of the time. I know you guys always play a couple of other chars "on the side" (remember how we used to rank up with each others sub chars lol), but lets face it we can only be good with X many chars, and player style and variety is something you cant get unless you have more players (not same player with multiple chars). I have actually dropped by Atrium a couple of times ever since they got FT.B, but theres never anyone there lol. Looks like I got to call up you guys before I go there or its just going to be another wasted trip or something.

Too bad zhifeng and the rest of the gang doesnt play anymore, those were some good times, and where the hell is freddy? Back in Oz?

 

That's right, I think evo ver B were great times.

VF, dinner, VF, then midnight snack..they were great days.

Train rides home with Danny and Ken were great memories.

Despite the shit sticks, I had fun week in and out.

(yeah I am back in OZ for the time being..BOO HOO HOO!)

 

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So until you get to that elite level, I would suggest thinking about improving your own skills than bitching about what tier your character belongs to.

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Oops, sorry, the above wasn't aimed at you specifically, but to people in general.

But yeah, I hear you, it's hard to get in again when there aren't that many players. I think we're all ready for VF5, and that's probably why most of us are checking T5 out.

BTW, I've pretty much given up on Atrium. Still $1 per play?? Greedy.

 

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hey shou! man, i would kill to get some english advice from a good player like you.

i lost my old card (6 dan goh) and ive got a new one, but im not subscribed to vf.net so it's a no-name, no item. i'm still a puny 2 kyu with a below 50% win rate so you probably wouldn't want to play me (ijime). hehe.

when are you usually there and what's your card name? and were you at ks3 and if not, what's your excuse? /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

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I go to Nishispo kind of randomly but usually in the late afternoon or evening. My ringname is always changing but it"s sure to have Shou in it somewhere except for when it"s Johnny Kage. Right now, it"s SHOU za suupaa amerikajin. Yup, I was at KS3 with GuttiYuki, Kurita and company.

 

Re: Alucard

Hey, buddy. Listen carefully.

KS3 was the greatest tourney I've ever watched, and before you stepped in and talked about your useless BS, everyone was expressing their joys about the tourney and the game that we all enjoy playing.

Nobody appreciates how you pooped in the thread,and I am certainly not one of them. It was a great tourney as it is, and I can't care less about what your logics are in your argument.

You came as nothing but a whiner to this ONE OF THE FEW AWESOME THINGS THAT HAVE HAPPENED TO THE WESTERN VF COMMUNITY IN A WHILE. NOW STOP SPOILING IT.

 

I think the game prettty 80% balance except a few specific character match up,s which I shall not mention else 'Know It All' Ice-9 argues otherwise. I was Very Supprise when some of the top players in Japan told me and explain to me about it.

If tiers doesn't exist at Copper lvls, then keep playing till that level. Imo, some characters need more time to master compared to other. It took me 10times as much time needed to master Akira compared to Kage or Shun. I dare say no1 in SG has as much determination(or dumbness) to spend so much time and effort to master the game. My Akira used to lose ALL the time.

If there's no 1 to play against to get that that 'Copper' level, then quit the game. Lol. Why ague about a useless point in VFDC and invite flames? Both Jeffrey and I are pretty much sick playing your backdashing techniques too.lol. Hell, both of us are sick of playing each other.

Anyway, Zhifeng and the rest of us switch to Tekken for a while before Bugis ugrades to ver.B and we can show of our Tsuwamono cards. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Anyway, I'm getting too old and slow to play VF anymore. Besides, you are older than me too. /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Come to Tekken5~~~~

 

getting back on topic, i just saw about half of the kakutou shinseiki matches and I am very impressed. GO ITAZAN!!!! I missed a lot of the matches in the middle but I saw all the early ones and of course the final. Some of the players in the early rounds got a pretty raw deal I thought. I liked the form of the Pai that lost to edo (I think, or maybe koedo... at least it was a kage) in the first round. I also liked the look of the vanessa who lost to a brad in the first round. sorry I don't remember the names. I guess the opposition was just too good for both of them. Also chofu k k sara was awesome too although I am not a big lau fan.

 

Re: Alucard

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Hey, buddy. Listen carefully.

KS3 was the greatest tourney I've ever watched, and before you stepped in and talked about your useless BS, everyone was expressing their joys about the tourney and the game that we all enjoy playing.

Nobody appreciates how you pooped in the thread,and I am certainly not one of them. It was a great tourney as it is, and I can't care less about what your logics are in your argument.

You came as nothing but a whiner to this ONE OF THE FEW AWESOME THINGS THAT HAVE HAPPENED TO THE WESTERN VF COMMUNITY IN A WHILE. NOW STOP SPOILING IT.


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Im no buddy of yours.

I couldnt care less about what you think either. If somebody can make a random comment like "VF is balanced, char doesnt matter!", then I dont see anything wrong with making a random comment too.

You speak as if no one agrees with me and I cant express my opinion about something as subjective as "balance in vf". Your opinions not > mine.

 

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I think the game prettty 80% balance except a few specific character match up,s which I shall not mention else 'Know It All' Ice-9 argues otherwise. I was Very Supprise when some of the top players in Japan told me and explain to me about it.

If tiers doesn't exist at Copper lvls, then keep playing till that level. Imo, some characters need more time to master compared to other. It took me 10times as much time needed to master Akira compared to Kage or Shun. I dare say no1 in SG has as much determination(or dumbness) to spend so much time and effort to master the game. My Akira used to lose ALL the time.

If there's no 1 to play against to get that that 'Copper' level, then quit the game. Lol. Why ague about a useless point in VFDC and invite flames? Both Jeffrey and I are pretty much sick playing your backdashing techniques too.lol. Hell, both of us are sick of playing each other.

Anyway, Zhifeng and the rest of us switch to Tekken for a while before Bugis ugrades to ver.B and we can show of our Tsuwamono cards. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Anyway, I'm getting too old and slow to play VF anymore. Besides, you are older than me too. /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif



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Yea, thats the thing that I was talking about. If char doesnt matter like some claim, a certain Tetsujin wouldnt have said that Minami's Akira had a 7 : 3 advantage when he played Heruru's Lei in a certain tourney final, and he wasnt talking about player ability.

Obviously, there are tiers if some char match ups are harder than some. The chars with the most advantageous matchups will naturally come out on top.

I cant say I agree with you on the Akira thing. Akira is mostly about command input, his okizeme and setups are pretty straight forward mostly, heck his game used to be about SDE 50+% of the time. There are some chars that require less practice, command input wise, but they take a lot more thinking strategy wise eg. Brad. Your Akira where got lose all the time? Your evo Akira was scary as hell, I would get nightmares of myself getting MC SDE after playing your Akira lol.

I dont think I will ever quit playing cos its still fun. I play much less nowadays cos I've been busy with other stuff and theres less players now so I also somewhat lazy to go down to arcades.

Its only a pointless argument if somebody wants to make it one. Some kids just cant take comments like "omfg I think your favourite game has FLAWS!", laff. Its like I just said something bad about their mom or something.

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Come to Tekken5~~~~

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ya wait for me, I need to practise first. I used to be T3 tourney runner up ok, dont play play. lol.

 

So VF became balanced when Shun won KSIII. You just wait till you see another kage vs kage final and then opnions will change again. Alucard your pleas are falling on deef ears because the people you are arguing against use the character that makes the game unbalanced so they will defend their character so dont waste your time. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

ya wait for me, I need to practise first. I used to be T3 tourney runner up ok, dont play play. lol.

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Fwah!~~~~~~~~~~

 

It seems to me that when discussing various aspects of VF, some things are taken for granted. For instance, all this talk about VF being balanced or not ignores imo one thing: you need to define your terms. What does "balance" mean? I can look it up in the dictionary but I doubt the definitions listed could tell me if VF is balanced or not.

Before one can talk about if VF is balanced or not, the first thing that needs to be clarified or agreed upon is what does "balanced" mean in the relation to VF.

Would a match between 2 of the same characters be balanced? I would be inclined to say yes, but it's obvious that the outcome of such a match would depend on who's playing those chars. Is VF balanced if I was using my Akira vs Ohsu's Akira? I mean, it's the same exact character and everything! We can perform the same exact moves! More importantly, we have the same exact constraints. The engine controls what we can perform and technically there's nothing he can do that I cannot. I would have to say that the 2 of the same characters are balanced. However, it's obvious that the skill of the player plays an exceedingly important role of the outcome of the match. With my example above, I wouldn't be surprised that if I played Ohsu 100 times, he'd win at least 99 times. Does that change the fact that VF is or is not balanced? I hope not.

Now it's harder to determine if two different chars are balanced or not. How could you compare balance issues between Pai and Wolf? or anybody? Does Pai being faster but doing less damage per hit make things balanced to Wolf's slower but more damage per hit? How do you even compare?

In my mind, the only thing that's balanced in VF is that all chars have the same opportunities in the same particular situations. For example, everybody has a throw (or throws) that execute in 8 frames. Every successful dodge is executed in 17(?) frames (or was it 19?). I don't remember the exact numbers. Everybody can throw escape throw escapable throws (say that 5 times fast!) the same exact way. You can't be thrown with a standard throw if you're executing a move. I guess to me, "balanced" = "consistent" in terms of VF. I also feel that in VF, I always have options... they may not be obvious, but I feel no matter what situation I'm in, there's a way out. I don't have the same feeling about Tekken or Soul Calibur, but at the same time, I don't understand those games as well as VF. However, in Tekken 5 for example, it seems to me that something is just fishy about dodging. I can't dodge moves but other people can dodge mine. I get hit like 90% of the time I try to dodge. It seems random to me. Also you can be thrown in the middle of your moves but sometimes you'll hit the other guy when they try to throw. You can tell because you'll see the throw "hit mark". Sometimes I could swear I'm blocking and get hit anyway by otherwise blockable moves. But again, it's probably my lack of understanding about the game. But in my own defense, I have programmed a fighting game (2D) and I feel that consistency is important and Tekken doesn't seem to be. Lack of consistency makes a game much less fun imo. I like Tekken 5 though. Go figure.

I don't think anybody on this board has even mentioned what they think balance means. There's no agreed upon definition... and probably won't ever be. However, for me, same character matches are balanced; different chars are not. The game engine is consistent regardless of who you play. When I say consistent, I mean the engine gives all characters the same opportunity for any situation. Also for the most part, nothing unexpected happens... meaning that you can figure out why something happened the way it did just by understanding the mechanics of the game and that these things can be reproduced easily.

Finally, is VF balanced? To me, no. Is it unfair? No. These are things I like about VF, but they aren't the only ones. I like VF simply because the rules are clear. With other fighting games, it seems the rules always have these random exceptions that crop up more often than they should.

Sorry for the long drawn out post.

 

I wont say anything in return because i might get banned for voicing an opnion about kage.

But like i said before people will defend their character and your post kinda just proved it. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

Remi Here's a couple of words:
Pot, kettle, black , pai
You figure out the rest. /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif

P.s FUCK TIERS!!!! /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

I still can't believe the result of KS-III but in my mind SHIT HAPPENS!

 

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Pot, kettle, black , pai

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Seriously.

 

yeah, i agree...

even if people have already made their conclusions, every point in this thread is just being recycled anywayz ---- tbh, there are no new points to make /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif -- NONE!! everything just says the same things in a different approach!

so yeah ~ shun shun shun!.. even though if any shun would win a major tourney, it's gotta be itazan.