Can't anyone make it to the FINAL arcade!

AI flaws

I've playing on and off for only a few months now, and I personally only just got to the last arcade with wolf (I rotate between wolf, aoi, goh and vanessa).

I like the AI in the last arcade, and personally do find it challenging and I think it does help extend my ability. However, there are undoubtly some AI flaws which the programmers apparently didn't cover. It's not as bad as the Kumite crap like all the Vanessa stuff, never throw countering Aoi's doublestop, never escaping low throws, etc., but Evo does have serious AI flaws as well. Against Wolf, I noticed -

b,b+p+g
If you time it right, the AI will whiff a move, and get caught by this move all the time. And you then don't need to do any other option but the most damaging, because the AI never escapes.

f,f+p
The AI thinks it can block this move. So it'll just stand there and get hit. Free ground throw attempt follows. Works even you do this move a mile away, where a human would see it coming long beforehand, take a coffee break, and then duck and erase half you health.

Pretty risky moves in Vs, but works too well in Quest. Defintely not as bad as the Kumite stuff, but this works for the champions and the phoenix jacky that I've come across. And yes, this is on std.

 

Re: AI flaws

No aznri, I don't quit matches before I lose. Trust me- once you crack the game it is very easy. The CPU is a real sucker at the later arcades for and throw or jab and throw. It will always break the low throw on a stomach crumble, but never the ground throw in any situation. Even champions start attacking in stupid situations like after you've been knocked down, letting you get a free MC. Even worse, if you knock it down it will 9/10 go for a rising attack, letting you get a free low throw or other damaging response.

The AI will very frequently bite delayed attacks after a low punch or jab. You can always give it a beating by just timing your kicks and jabs to MC its predictable response, then hitting throw when you think it will evade. The 'Win against a champion with an excellent three times' quest was very easy like this.

Any why does the CPU never break low throws after a blocked sweep? Why omit this in programming? Top of my wishlist for VF5 is a tougher AI with more variation. I'm bored with evading the crap out of Hana Bei Ray (Lei Fei). Top of my wishlist for VF as a whole would be having someone in my half of the country who actually plays... Ain't gonna happen though- all my friends play FPS.

 

Re: AI flaws

this thread just keeps on changing. Its gone from AI, to 'we hate emp' to 'shut the hell up about minami' (the last two probably being able to fit under the same column), and now back to the AI again. Sorry I didnt have anything useful to say, but i just had to mention this.

By the way is there a I hate emp club? Are you guys all members? /versus/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

 

Re: AI flaws

Just adding my own two cents..
I agree that the AI is flawed. .(But then again has anybody seen yet a perfect FG AI?)

If you play VF4Evo CPU like you would play a human, you have hard time and playing like this will definitely sharpen your game..
However, it is possible to play anti-CPU. Use tricks that computer will eat. Get your win percentage high etc. This play however will not improve your versus play.

By the way, I play Akira and noticed that computer will never, ever escape Akiras + - + - - DbPm combo. Nice chunk of unescapable damage in case of CPU. (I have over 3000 matches with Akira and comp has not once escaped Akiras catch-combo)

Also CPU has a tendency to do rising attacks so just back off and DbPm or some other long range attack will do nicely (Jacky etc ).

- ManjiMaru

 

Re: AI flaws

Yes. Doing that Jacky´s , +, combo-of- your-choice jerk off is definitely one of the best ways to get high win percentages. With other characters, other okizeme moves are also often too good for the stupid AI.
IMHO, it´s simply no use playing like a moron and backstepping all the time, waiting for enemy to make a mistake. It´s definitely more challenging and fun to use walls for tactics, or try some new strategy, or try to play like "A million people are watching you". Trust me, it makes you a better person.

-Who, Me?!- /versus/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

Re: AI flaws

Oh yeah, the AI never breaks df ground throws, does dumb rising attacks, etc. - yeah those are others that really need to be corrected. I think the AI has a serious problem with whiffing moves in general, too. I'm like a mile away, and the AI is just hammering away into thin air- too easy to exploit. Well anyway, so I beat the last arcade and won the wmac with wolf- too easily with these cheesy AI tactics. Yeah, yeah, kinda hollow. The thing is, although you try not to use them, when you are fighting for that red chest or something, it's hard not to use them.

 

Re: AI flaws

[ QUOTE ]
agios_katastrof said:

Oh yeah, the AI never breaks df ground throws

[/ QUOTE ]

i just got + (ground throw) broken yesterday by an AI

 

Re: AI flaws

It breaks it once every million fights. It feels cheap knowing that your + gets a free chunk of damage afterwards because the A.I. is too stupid to escape the groundthrow (ground punch is usually a safe bet after the groundthrow too for even more damage) when a human would at least narrow it down to 50/50 by escaping a direction. Still doesn't stop me using it every time though /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

Re: AI flaws

[ QUOTE ]
Elite said:

It breaks it once every million fights. It feels cheap knowing that your + gets a free chunk of damage afterwards because the A.I. is too stupid to escape the groundthrow (ground punch is usually a safe bet after the groundthrow too for even more damage) when a human would at least narrow it down to 50/50 by escaping a direction. Still doesn't stop me using it every time though /versus/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah exact same here. Used to make me feel really dirty.

 

Re: AI flaws

Aoi´s full circle throw back+ground throw, only one A.I (Homestay A) has gotten up quickly enough to avoid it....

 

Re: AI flaws

A.I. also eats the crippler cross face ground throw after his +, + throw. I've yet to have this broken once.

 

Re: AI flaws

Btw, it's apparent why these AI flaws escaped Am2's QA. Obviously Am2 used the upper tier Japanese players for QA, so a lot of the stuff that the top tier players don't use got missed. Am2 needs to hire some scrubs, rather than these Chibita types. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif Really.

 

Re: AI flaws

[ QUOTE ]
agios_katastrof said:

Btw, it's apparent why these AI flaws escaped Am2's QA. Obviously Am2 used the upper tier Japanese players for QA, so a lot of the stuff that the top tier players don't use got missed. Am2 needs to hire some scrubs, rather than these Chibita types. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif Really.

[/ QUOTE ]
With sexy results /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

Re: AI flaws

Not just AM2 but any game company could benefit from hiring scrubs to test their games.

Anyways i was having trouble consistently beating the AI on the last couple arcades (despite the ability to exploit down throws etc) but then i read this page.

I've always had trouble escaping throws, but once i started memorizing which throw directions are particularly damaging for each character my game vs the AI improved 100%.

Are there any throw escape documents that take post-throw guranteed damage into consideration? For example, Aoi's is guranteed after + for a total of xx points of damage (i don't even know).

 

Re: AI flaws

you can read this
it's a lot of reading, but he deals with many attacks/and if they guarantee light down attacks.

 

Re: AI flaws

i have come 1st in all tournaments with lei fei and still have an 80% record. is that gd?

 

Re: AI flaws

the champion level a.i's (e.g chibita's) are modeled after real life counterparts---so does that mean excluding champions, every a.i. in the game is fictional such as heroes, guardians, hunters, etc???

 

The final arcade is hard. The AI Champs are not that tough. I beaten those players, so key pharse: THINK BEFORE U LEAP!