Bad Games Thread

On Lei Fei's defence, he actually has LESS moves that are positive on block than Vanessa. THAT said, the problem is that some of his moves are fast mids. Anyway, copying from his command list:

Default Stance
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif HP +2
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif MP +1
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif MDP +/-0

Hai Shiki
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif HP +4
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif MDP +6 /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif

Boku Tai
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif MK,MK stagger

Doku Ritsu
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif HK +2
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif HK +2

Ne Han Shiki /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif MP,HP +/-0 (Sabaki)
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif H*K +5
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif HP,MP +/-0 (Sabaki)
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif MP +4
/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif H*CR +2

...plus 3 more moves from his BT stances.

They are just frames though, no knockdowns on Hit or CH, except for Bokutai /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif and BT koko shiki /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif and i don't think he gets floats off of them. They're no Akira single palm/modified standing palm/overhead smash/overhead double palm/p+k,p+k.

 

single palm isn't positive on block... it pushes back right but it's -8

 

Modified sinle palm is +3 according to the command list /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/whistle.gif

 

ah ok the Kuzushi one... Well I think it's a rare case since it comes after heavy guard breaks/staggers and you almost never do modified single palms in those case, but right I forgot it

 

GREAT FUCKING POST! I read it twice!

 

I have to say Social Ruin, I think most people here agree Lei is the strongest character in the game. Others are close but not quite the same just because Lei's damage is immense. Lei should beat Sarah most of the time anyway.

But you play Lei and I'm sure you know better than me how cheap or not-cheap he is. I've seen people pull off wins with Lei that they just couldn't get with another character. He is really one of the only guys in the game that you can mash and have success.

That's why he got nerfed in R.

 

I totally agree with your attitude and plan. Shows maturity and the ability to play to win. "Bleh - Safe/rinse/repeat", "X technique is boring", and "X character is broken/too strong" = limiting your chance to improve.

Just so you know, you can't fuzzy CH /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif throw.

 

Yeah that's what I was saying in my next post. I think I tried to fuzzy ch p throw like a retard, that's why my statement could be biased ^^
Thanks for the confirmation /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

 

I certainly don't /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

 

P throw is a great thing to do.

btw I don't agree with your last sentence either, you can use adv defensive techniques in stances. I personally do it all the time, for example covering your catch throws with TE's.

I don't think Lei Fei is the strongest character in the game either.

 

^You're right, Dural is...

SS: Dural, Lei-Fei
S: Goh, Kage etc...

 

What's Goh doing there? Is this the hate tiers?

Cause if so:

SSS: Goh, Aoi, Pai, Wolf, Lei Fei... and the newest member Eileen(they make her look like that on purpose cause you'd really want to hate her otherwise).

 

WTF was that slide? have you ever played social ruin? or are just assuming to know his playstyle? he fuzzies and throw escapes more than most people online.

IMO, Sarah is pretty messed up to. you can make all the same advantage disadvantage arguments about her, especially online. But granted i don't really understand her moveset all that well.

And seriously, p throw, 2p throw. This is tough for anyone to deal with, you can't say its not. I have played almost all the upper echelon players from here, and they all fall victim to it. the better the player, the better they deal with it, but that being said, I have caught: gentleman thief, jhow, konjou, adamyuki, you, EVERYONE. No one is immune to the tick throws, they are hard to stop. Again better players handle it better, but to say "Oh, you say in gg thread this is tough, maybe your magic charactar has allowed you to win games without being able jump the basic hurdles" is just misinformed and speaking out of turn.


note: i did just see the disclaimer, which has softened my stance to your response, but i still think you took way too many assumptions and presented your argument in a condescending manner, whether intentional or just poor communication of your thoughts and ideas.

editorial note: This is not a defense of lei fei, from having switched to pai for a month i can see that lei fei is extra strong in that if you catch someone in one mistake, you can drain significant power. If someone has trouble stagger recovery, you catch one low attack and you can get 70+ pts of damage!! It takes less correct guesses for you and less mistakes for your oppponent to win. (again, i think sarah falls into this same catagory, even if her options are more risky to initiate). This was a defense of my bro. To see someone come in and blindly tear down someone's ability, when that player is working so hard to be fundamentally sound, few on this board have worked as hard at all the fundamentals/and advanced techniques, and then been able to apply them well in combat. To come in and say, maybe you don't know the basics and are where you are b/c you use charactar xyz?!?!
An S tier charactar is no substitute for hard work. And social ruin has definitely worked very hard to gain his minimal, yet significant mastery over 1 of the 17 fighters sega chose to put onto the game.

 

Lei feels mid tier to me, it's that Pai and Kage I got to watch out for.

The P> throw thing is lolz, basic nitaku getting peoples pants all wet, awwwww.

Also...

People getting bad Games cause they lost?! This thread is just getting silly now.

 

note:

Lei fei is misunderstood /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif
so maybe you guys have a point....they do say all the truly great ones are misunderstood /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif
Translation: Edgar allan poe was SSS tier

 

This editorial made me out to look like the antagonist to this story. I could be. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

 

Lol at this situation, I'll never understand why some people feel the need to defend how strong a character is they play in a game.

 

If my understanding is correct, the Japanese people that make the tiers list Lei as the sole S+ character. I believe they they make these tiers by looking at the movelist and evaluating the strengths of each character's options. After looking at Lei, they put him a cut above everybody else.

Lei is S+ plus tier because his moves and their properties are very powerful. This does not take into account how incomprehensible Lei is to a VF player who does not make it his life's mission to learn the moves of every character in the game.

What I am saying is that Lei would be toughest guy in the game even if everyone knew all his moves from all his stances. When you consider that he is probably the most confusing guy to go up against once he starts vogueing, he may as well be S+++ tier.

I am not saying that we should just boycott Lei matches or something. Just go into them as dispassionately as you can and know that it is...not...exactly...fair...

 

Japanese tiers don't apply to online. And Lei is not in his own tier.

 

Pretty messed up. Even if you evade it, he recovers fast enough to react.

The only light of this move is it's evasive properties. If you guard it, you can stagger recover and still have time for guaranteed damage or a free throw attempt.

I hate this one so much, typically because I don't use it alot and Numbers does. It's delayable, and the double leaves him in doku. If you 2p at the wrong time you're eating a reversal. If you guard them, he can do steps to avoid highs and mids. Your best bet is to evade to his front.

Generally speaking, Lei-Fei can be too reckless for the user's own good. If you're uncomfortable with abaring, he's extremely tough to learn playing as. For this same reason, Lei-Fei players are definitely frightening. And in that sense, Lei is definitely a double-edged sword. There aren't many characters that can (SAFELY!!!) bust near 90 damage on EVERYONE regardless of stance (No wall). He's gonna be harder to play with in R, his max damages are lower. 2_6p loses its high evasion. I'm not sure how fast his doku catch throw goes, but in VF5 the same command is a 14f mid.