Frame data for Wolf's 46pg catch throw possibly incorrect

Hello all,

I believe the frame data, which lists wolf's catch throw as 15 frames, is incorrect. I think the correct number is 20 frames.

Here is my demonstration.

In dojo mode, go to free training and set Wolf v Wolf. Set the CPU to record command.

Step 1
Record the CPU to do:

,

The mid kick has a recovery of 9 frames, and wolf's standing p has a startup of 12 frames. That's 21 frames total.

Try to do the catch throw in between the mid kick and the punch. This succeeds, which implies the catch throw must be less than 21 frames.

Step 2
Record the CPU to do:

,

The final p in the first sequence has a recovery of 8 frames, and wolf's standing p has a startup of 12 frames. That's 20 frames total.

Try to do a catch throw in between the last p and the next p. This fails, which implies the catch throw must be 20 frames or more.

So I think the info in the frame data is incorrect. Does anyone have thoughts on this, or see an error in my reasoning?

Zass

 

It is CATCH throw, not throw. It will not automatically lose against striking attacks.
I am afraid this only proves Catch is faster that 27 frames (+15 + 12 frames for jab)

Just today, I Catch Jacky out of flipkick when he try to use it at like -8 or so.

 

This was proven wrong:

 

Oh, my bad. I misunderstand your post. Sorry.

I did some testing as well.

WTF is this shit. Catch winning situations with 22 free frames and any situation starting with +9 or better advantage vs standing move (15 or better vs crouching)??????? FFS sega

Anyway, it probably is not 15 frames after all

 

Interesting thread, it reminds me my recent experimentations about Brad's Catch Throw that I have done for the Frame Data for Stance Entry.

From my test, 6P CH Duck P+G can at best intercept a move that executes on 16 frames, which would mean, by analogy with the other ducking moves, that the catch throw should execute on 24 frames (instead of 17 frames).

But I didn't bother to recheck with another scenario, I had no clue that it could be inconsistent...

 

I've been looking at my Bradygames VF5 guide, and in the catch throw section it says that catch throws will be strikes if they hit the incoming attack during the first half of the startup frames.

If we look at that explanation, then my first example becomes
9 frames for the mid kick, then 12/2 = 6 frames for the punch. That's 15 frames, and the catch wins. This implies the catch is at least 15 frames.

The second example becomes
8 frames for the ppp string, then 12/2 = 6 frames for the bunch. That's 14 frames, and the catch loses. This implies the catch is no more than 14 frames.

So by that reasoning, we get 15f for the catch (loses on ties with strikes).

I haven't done the math on all of Unicorn's examples, but doing a few of them it works out with the catch at 15 frames.

This would mean strategically, that catch throws are good to use when the opponent is at big disadvantage and attacking small, rather than when they are at small disadvantage and attacking big (if that makes sense), because the follow up attack is counted at only half frames.

 

Just a quick question... Aren't catch throws supposed to automatically lose to normal throws?
I tested Catch vs normal throw. Catch wins from -10 on; on -9, normal throw wins.
...
I am really confused now On other hand, it will still make sense to what Zass posted - normal throw have 10 frames exe, so -10 and 1/2 of 10 exe = 15; Catch wins..?

Edit: further testing shows Catch loses vs 9-frames t hrow at -10; so probably the logic Zass pointed out apply even on throws..?