Are Lobbies, Twitch, & Youtube Enough?

Each time a new version of VF comes out , there is always the hope that this time the game will stick. This time the FG community will get it and they'll see what a great game VF is and this time the new players, visitors, and casuals will stay and play the game longer and the player base will finally grow. But each time we are disappointed There is a temporary VF frenzy (lots of visitors and new players) for about 30-45 days and when the dust settles its basically the same player base that's been around for the last 15 years.

But this time is different. This time we have streamers that are streaming the game on Twitch and Youtube. We have Discord, Twitter, Instagram and lots of social media. Maybe all VF needs is a little more exposure If the FGC could all just finally see what VF looks like and how beautiful high level play can be that would be enough and the Internet and social media will change things right?

But there is one BIG flaw in all of this. Over the last 15 years as online features have been added to Fighting Games, Tekken 5 Dark Resurrection was released in 2006 with online, the trend has been to divert the budget away from single player content and put most (if not all ) the eggs in the online player basket. And now with online features, streaming and social media more players have access to FG s than ever before. People can play each other from around the world, there are world tournaments, and Fighting Games have never been more visible than they are now But as a genre the player base although more visible than ever before has been steadily shrinking Instead of growing the fighting game market is steadily shrinking a while more visible as its shrinking.

As game publishers move the budgets from single player content to online content and focus on the more competitive and high level players, they leave, the noobs, and casual players out of the picture And that's the problem The most cherished, favored and beloved versions of all of the 3D fighting games, Tekken, Virtua Fighter, DOA, and Soul Calibur were all heavy on single player content and all were made before the addition on online play Its this single player content that kept the noobs and the casual players interested. The single player content is what made all of these games as big as they were The secret and elephant in the room here is that the Single Player, Noob, and Casual player base is always the majority of a FG base about 65%-75% of the base were originally single player, noobs, and casuals. Yes the 25%-35% that represents the high level, competitive, online-loving players is always more visible and more vocal. But the largest player base for the 3D fighting games has always been the casual and single player crowd. But FG developers and publishers have forsaken the silent majority in favor of the highly visible and vocal minority. They've bolstered Online Content at the expense of Single player Content


So far, Virtua Fighter 5 Ultimate Showdown has only the barest of bones Arcade Mode for Single Player. If there is not significant single player content added to VF5US in the very near future, I don't think that lobbies, Twitch and Youtube will be enough to significantly grow the player base beyond the core faithfuls that have never really left the game. Sure the battle hardened faithful will always play the game. They never stop, there has always been some VF being played somewhere in the world since its inception. But this time we are hoping that the game can grow and thrive and move beyond the small niche that its been trapped in for the last 15 years.

But with no significant Single Player content Virtua Fighter and all the rest of the 3D fighting games will continue to be highly visible via Twitch and Youtube but their player bases will continue to shrink, and the FG genre market share in compared to other genres will continue to get smaller, and that's because publishers and developers hoped to cut corners and maximize profit by getting rid of the more expensive Single Player content e.g. (quality AI, single player modes, story modes, cut scenes, plot lines etc) and putting their budgets and efforts into netcode.

For a fighting game to grow and thrive it must be very strong in 3 areas

• Single Player Content
• Offline Modes & Support (e.g. tournament mode with brackets, and profiles)
  
• Online Modes & Support

To grow and thrive it needs all three. To survive it needs at least 2 out of those 3. Currently VF5US is only focused in one area. If this remains true, in about 3 months the VF community will be back to the same small, but dedicated and loyal diehards

 

Unfortunately, nothing is really enough at this point. The game came out at a terrible time, a week before a fighting game that boasts the best netcode in history. The release for Ultimate Showdown needed to be perfect in order to keep the momentum. I don't feel like being negative so I'll just leave it at that... How quickly the game gained and lost momentum is just astonishing. Reminds me of the stock market.

 

Yes netcode is rumored to be good But even more important than the netcode,

Guilty Gear Strive has some amazing single player content, and supposedly a ton of single player content coming:

https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2021/01/guilty_gear_strive_confirms_a_bunch_of_single-player_modes

So in addition to having good netcode for online, its got a lot of value offline for single player and the lack of single player content is what's going to stop VF5US dead in its tracks. No 3D Fighting game, is surviving and growing without serious single player content. Not one. Even Tekken 7 has Treasure Battle Mode.

The small community of elite, and hardcore players will always be there for VF5US. Now that there are lobbies, tournament modes, the hardcore will be happy. At least for as long as Sega can afford to pay for the servers

But the thing that really causes a fighting game to not only survive, but to grow and flourish is the single player content consider: Tekken series, Soul Calibur series, Gilty Gear series, Mortal Kombat series, etc. The high level, pro players never want to credit a FG success to its single player content, story modes, character profiles, cutscenes, endings etc. But the fact of the matter is the most success FGs Have( and in some cases had) very strong single player content.

VF4EVO is probably the most popular and loved version of VF. The Quest Mode, the Underground Tournaments, The incredible dojo mode. This was all offline, single player content and is to this day still requested for VF5US.

VF5US desperately needs Single Player modes i.e.

• Quest Mode
• License Mode
• Sparring Mode
• Team Battle Mode

Without single player modes the VF5US will be back down to the old PSN/XBL numbers (with a few new stragglers) within 3 months. I truly hope Sega has single player modes planned for DLC, if not even online will be a graveyard as soon as

• Tekken 8
• Street Fighter 6
• DOA 7
• Soul Calibur 7

are launched. VF5US still has a chance, but even rollback netcode will not save it, without the obligatory Single Player content that's needed to augment online. I also don't want to be negative. But the marketing facts are what they are. I play my share of online VF, but I know for a fact , based on comments from many many players on my friends list (I'm a casual VF player), that will not play the game long if no Single Player content is added. For every 25 VF players that only care about online, there are 75-80 players that primarily enjoy offline single player VF content and would play online casual matches only if the single player content is there I fall in this category.

Yes the online players are highly visible and vocal, but in the words of Duncan Idaho from Dune:

"My lord, I suspect an incredible secret has been kept on this planet: that the Fremen exist in vast numbers"

The VF players that prefer Single player-offline modes to Online are pretty much like the Fremen they exist in vast numbers. And the biggest mistake Sega/AM2 could make would be sell them out

 

VF5US also had 20k viewers the first week...

This game should have released on every platforms with crossplay and with a better online (rollback).

The VF hype could be so much bigger.

 

They don't really care about VF5US. They care about VFeS. It's doing exactly what they built it to do.

 

I think it definitely helps a lot. The fact that the PS4 system has stream and capture features built into is a fantastic thing for the game. Now, we all can make videos, stream etc. Wether people will watch is another story, but, anyone can put the content out there if they want without having to buy extra equipment.

As far as Strive being released so close, from my point of view it's a good thing (depending on the player.) People got a taste of VF. A fighting game with a great foundation and system mechanics etc. Most everyone that plays VF says they like it. That person will just have to compare it to the next fighting game they play. When I got a taste of VF after a friend recommended it to me, I fell in love with fighting games again because of how fair the game felt and the freedom of movement. My character knowledge still barely exists, but, I know you can't really smother people in VF like you can in other fighting games. At least that's how it feels to me. I still get smothered sometimes simply because I don't have character knowledge, but I know there's ways to defend or counter it.

If VFs netcode gets better, I think the game's popularity will rise again.

 

Agreed, netcode, and a few improvements with the lobbies and a lot of people will play more. But if Sega adds

• Quest Mode
• Team Battle Mode

If will attract new players and a lot more casuals will come learn the game, join the VF community and stay. Most (not all) new players need single player modes to have fun learning the game. Most(not all) new players don't want to learn the game playing against someone that knows 100 times more than they do.

Fixing the netcode and the lobbies are only part of solution. VF5US needs single player content. If we don't get it we're just going to end up with the same old players we have over the last 15 years.

I want to see the community significantly grow. That won't happen unless they add some serious single player content to this game soon.

 

Well, VF5FS has already been ported to the PS4 in the Yakuza, and Judgment games. Why not just provide the full VF5FS for PS4

 

I wouldn't say no to a quest mode. How much of their budget would a quest mode actually have taken. I have seen dozens of request you people forwarded to Sega , and quest mode wasn't one of them. Good fucking job.

 

Single player stuff helps, but at the end of the day I doubt it really matters. SF5 basically came out with little to no single player stuff and it was still successful or popular enough.

The game has to have appeal. I am more or less disappointed with VF5US because the game was created to appeal to competitive players while missing key competitive features that are required these days. What I think VF needed is a great experience that allows the smaller player base in each country to play each other without any connection issues or comprimises. This would widen the player pool and help the community grow. This might have been their intention but the netcode just isn't there, so now you have an issue where the game doesn't attract the general audience and also leaves a bitter taste in the players that have remained faithful to the game.

As for why people don't stick with VF... At the end of the day if the girl (or guy) you're dating is awesome but you're not physically attracted to them, then logically you end up moving on for the most part, right? VF is an awesome game, but it doesn't have the appeal to the mass audience. It lacks the edginess or cool factor.

 

Edginess and cool factor

Can you give examples of some other fighting games that have edginess and cool factor

What cool factor and edginess is VF5US missing

 

I don't agree with VF doesn't have appeal. I think the VF characters are sick, and it's not the real problem.

In 2021, online and multiplayer games have to be on point, or the players will look for another game in less than 2 days.

Fighting games need a solid online with a perfect netcode and great ranked/room mode to be very successful. I'm sorry but VF5US doesn't have that at all.

If VF was totally not my fighting game, i would drop this shit after a few hours and never touch it again. This online is just TERRIBLE, people that don't care about this franchise and are not into VF just see this game as a simple waste of time.

 

There are no highly successful 3D Fighting games without a least one serious single player mode. None! All of the most successful 3D fighting games good netcode, bad netcode all have at least one. solid single player mode. It doesn't matter if VF5US gets perfect rollback, if it doesn't get at least one solid single player mode e.g. something like Quest Mode it will be back to a very small dedicated online community of die hards in less than 6 months.

You've got to realize that without their Single Player modes Tekken, Mortal Kombat, Soul Calibur , DOA, would have never gotten as far as they have.

YES, YES, YES, YES we all want perfect rollback netcode. But if VF5US doesn't get at least one significant single player mode along with that rollback, it will be back to the same old 100 or so die hard players hosting streams, and tourneys keeping hope alive

 

Tekken 7 has no offline (it's very bad) lol but at least his online didn't force you to play unplayable connections from all around the world.

 

Sry mate, Tekken does have serious offline single player modes and content
Treasure Battle and Story Mode in addition to Arcade Mode also cinematics, intros, endings, movies, etc.

In Treasure Battle:

• You can Win Customization Items
• You can Rank Up
• There are Special Matches
• You can Win Money (To buy customization items)

Treasure Battle is like Survival + Quest , and in Story Mode you can open up endings, etc. I primarily play Single Player modes in Tekken, VS Offline with family and friends, and only rarely get online.

AFAIK Every major release of Tekken has had at least one serious Single Player Mode or collection single player content outside of Arcade Mode.

Every major, successful 3D Arcade Fighting game, every single one of them has at least one significant Single player mode in addition to Arcade Mode. Without these Single Player modes none of these games would have achieved the sales success they have

Online is good. I'm not against it. But keep in mind Virtua Fighter didn't even have online modes until Virtua Fighter 5 And the Playstation didn't get a version with online modes until VF5FS And there were a whole helluva lot of happy VF players before Virtual Fighter 5. VF4 and VF4EVO had no online modes

So yeah, we all want solid netcode. Sounds like rollback is the ticket. But Virtua Fighter had life long before it had netcode. The most popular and beloved versions of Virtua Fighter don't even have online modes. So putting things in perspective VF5US is only the second release of VF on the Playstation that has Online Modes. I would hate to see this myopic obsession with VF Online to kill the game for good


Sega might not be able to keep paying for the online servers. But VF must go on.
The online VF community will probably become a ghost town in 6 months, but VF must go on.

To grow and thrive VF5US must eventually have:

• Solid Offline Tournament Mode support. Support for brackets, support for player profiles, and options to play the Tournament Mode in Single Player against CPU players

• Quest Mode (at minimum), Team Battle Mode (Single Player)

Even with rock solid rollback netcode, lobbies, Twitter, Twitch, Discord, Facebook and Youtube, if VF doesn't get significant offline Single Player & VS content for the casual player, then VF5US online will be a desert. Here's why.

There are only so many high level Fighting Game streamers and players, they can't play all of the FG at the same time. Just look at what happening right now. The high profile content streamers that were streaming and playing VF5US last week, are streaming and playing Guilty Gear Strive this week. (I won't mention any names) What will happen when we get

• Tekken 8
• DOA 7
• Soul Calibur 7
• SF6
• MK XII

Here is one progression from Single Player Modes to Online Modes

Many casual players play Single Player Modes and learn the game at their on pace. They get reasonable good playing the game in Single Player. The next step is to play family and friends in Offline Modes. They get even better and start to get a taste for human competition, Eventually they feel froggy enough to go online and start challenging strangers But if there is no significant single player content, you'll never see this progression. Hence VF5US becomes a ghost town, because the competitive FG players give their time to whichever FG is the most popular and is getting the most Twitch or Youtube views at the time